4 ms·

>science journalism I think this is the case for pretty much every area of journalism. If you are a subject matter expert, you quickly realize that 90% of cove

>science journalism I think this is the case for pretty much every area of journalism. If you are a subject matter expert, you quickly realize that 90% of coverage of that subject is dreadful.

chongli 7y ago
Yes, the Gell-Mann amnesia effect [1] needs to be made more widely known. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Crichton#GellMannAmnesiaEffect https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Crichton#GellMannAmnes...
- gerbilly 7y ago
  Yeah, but we've heard ad-nauseam about the Gell-Mann effect. I wish there were an equally clever idiom I could trot out when people criticise professions they probably know noting about. Journalism is an incredibly difficult field to work in, and journalism as a profession is just barely still a thing due to loss of advertising revenue to online platforms. Think about it, we've traded a profession that has historically been one of the few to tell truth to power for free cloud software. And we paid for our cloud software and for our and social media¹ skinner boxes, by voluntarily giving our own surveillance data to private non-acountable entities² which probably collude with the government, and which lose our data to organised crime a few times a year³. To me that doesn't sound so clever. 1: A kind of casino with the doors welded shut where the chips are the precious minutes of our lives. 2: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surveillance_capitalism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surveillance_capitalism. See also: https://privacysos.org/blog/nsa-calls-the-iphone-using-public-zombies-who-pay-for-their-own-surveillance/ https://privacysos.org/blog/nsa-calls-the-iphone-using-publi... 3: Equifax, yahoo data breaches just off the top of my head.
  - Alex63 7y ago
    >> I wish there were an equally clever idiom I could trot out when people criticise professions they probably know noting about. Isn't that "Pointy-Haired Boss syndrome"?
    - PhasmaFelis 7y ago
      Good point. https://dilbert.com/strip/1994-10-17 https://dilbert.com/strip/1994-10-17
  - 4ntonius8lock 7y ago
    I though there was a word for that: arrogance, especially when mixed in with ignorance. I.e. that's both arrogant and ignorant. Not an idiom, but direct and clear. I'm afraid there's a trend of not calling things by their name because someone might take offense.
- arkades 7y ago
  What I want is a name for the related effect: You read an article on your topic of expertise, it’s bullshit, you read another article, a relevant expert on it pipes up that “that’s bullshit!”, and the prevailing response is, “no, you’re wrong, I’ve read a bunch of articles on this topic.” That is, the Gell-Mann effect as a justification for over-ruling expert criticism.
  - blackflame7000 7y ago
    Brainwashed?
ssully 7y ago
I know it's really popular these days to shit on journalists, and I agree that the quality of some outlets can be less then desirable, but it is an incredibly difficult field that involves a lot of work, little pay, little thanks, and terrible job security. Looking at this article, there is no Author by-line, but just the "Global Health" topic. Digging in, their Global Health topic is managed by their "Global development" team, which has a single writer assigned to it on their Contributors page [1]. I am sure free lancers contribute to this section as well, but I am trying to illustrate that this team/writer is probably on the bottom of the totem pole when it comes to resources and priority. If this story would never have been written if it had to pass HN's level of scientific article standards. [1]: https://www.theguardian.com/index/contributors https://www.theguardian.com/index/contributors
- ekianjo 7y ago
  What is incredibly difficult about being a journalist? It is the core of their job to read stuff and know better than the average how to make sense of things they read. Not "very difficult" by any measure, we are simply witnessing sheer laziness.
  - ssully 7y ago
    I provided four reasons as to why an average journalists job is difficult, and an entire paragraph as to why this particular journalists job might be difficult. Also your description of a journalists "core" job is incredibly reductive. It would be like me saying a programmers job is to just "write code". It's accurate to a point, but fails to capture a majority of a programmers responsibilities and how they do it well.
  - urbanjunkie 7y ago
    Ignorant and arrogant. What a dick you are, you pathetic, incel waste of oxygen.
  - PhasmaFelis 7y ago
    You sound like the pointy-haired boss from Dilbert. "Anything I don't understand must be easy."
JDulin 7y ago
All journalism to the sufficiently informed looks like pathos. All journalism to the sufficiently uninformed looks like logos.
dang 7y ago
We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20943405 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20943405.

>science journalism I think this is the case for pretty much every area of journalism. If you are a subject matter expert, you quickly realize that 90% of coverage of that subject is dreadful.

chongli 7y ago

Yes, the Gell-Mann amnesia effect [1] needs to be made more widely known. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Crichton#GellMannAmnesiaEffect https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Crichton#GellMannAmnes...

gerbilly 7y ago
Yeah, but we've heard ad-nauseam about the Gell-Mann effect. I wish there were an equally clever idiom I could trot out when people criticise professions they probably know noting about. Journalism is an incredibly difficult field to work in, and journalism as a profession is just barely still a thing due to loss of advertising revenue to online platforms. Think about it, we've traded a profession that has historically been one of the few to tell truth to power for free cloud software. And we paid for our cloud software and for our and social media¹ skinner boxes, by voluntarily giving our own surveillance data to private non-acountable entities² which probably collude with the government, and which lose our data to organised crime a few times a year³. To me that doesn't sound so clever. 1: A kind of casino with the doors welded shut where the chips are the precious minutes of our lives. 2: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surveillance_capitalism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surveillance_capitalism. See also: https://privacysos.org/blog/nsa-calls-the-iphone-using-public-zombies-who-pay-for-their-own-surveillance/ https://privacysos.org/blog/nsa-calls-the-iphone-using-publi... 3: Equifax, yahoo data breaches just off the top of my head.
- Alex63 7y ago
  >> I wish there were an equally clever idiom I could trot out when people criticise professions they probably know noting about. Isn't that "Pointy-Haired Boss syndrome"?
  - PhasmaFelis 7y ago
    Good point. https://dilbert.com/strip/1994-10-17 https://dilbert.com/strip/1994-10-17
- 4ntonius8lock 7y ago
  I though there was a word for that: arrogance, especially when mixed in with ignorance. I.e. that's both arrogant and ignorant. Not an idiom, but direct and clear. I'm afraid there's a trend of not calling things by their name because someone might take offense.
arkades 7y ago
What I want is a name for the related effect: You read an article on your topic of expertise, it’s bullshit, you read another article, a relevant expert on it pipes up that “that’s bullshit!”, and the prevailing response is, “no, you’re wrong, I’ve read a bunch of articles on this topic.” That is, the Gell-Mann effect as a justification for over-ruling expert criticism.
- blackflame7000 7y ago
  Brainwashed?

ssully 7y ago

I know it's really popular these days to shit on journalists, and I agree that the quality of some outlets can be less then desirable, but it is an incredibly difficult field that involves a lot of work, little pay, little thanks, and terrible job security. Looking at this article, there is no Author by-line, but just the "Global Health" topic. Digging in, their Global Health topic is managed by their "Global development" team, which has a single writer assigned to it on their Contributors page [1]. I am sure free lancers contribute to this section as well, but I am trying to illustrate that this team/writer is probably on the bottom of the totem pole when it comes to resources and priority. If this story would never have been written if it had to pass HN's level of scientific article standards. [1]: https://www.theguardian.com/index/contributors https://www.theguardian.com/index/contributors

ekianjo 7y ago
What is incredibly difficult about being a journalist? It is the core of their job to read stuff and know better than the average how to make sense of things they read. Not "very difficult" by any measure, we are simply witnessing sheer laziness.
- ssully 7y ago
  I provided four reasons as to why an average journalists job is difficult, and an entire paragraph as to why this particular journalists job might be difficult. Also your description of a journalists "core" job is incredibly reductive. It would be like me saying a programmers job is to just "write code". It's accurate to a point, but fails to capture a majority of a programmers responsibilities and how they do it well.
- urbanjunkie 7y ago
  Ignorant and arrogant. What a dick you are, you pathetic, incel waste of oxygen.
- PhasmaFelis 7y ago
  You sound like the pointy-haired boss from Dilbert. "Anything I don't understand must be easy."

JDulin 7y ago

All journalism to the sufficiently informed looks like pathos. All journalism to the sufficiently uninformed looks like logos.

dang 7y ago

We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20943405 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20943405.