5 ms·

It still amazes me, to this day, that people have jobs where they have the time to screw around on their computer all day. How do these jobs continue to exist?

whorleater 7y ago
I screw around at least 25% of the time as a dev
- momokoko 7y ago
  If you don't mind me asking, how do get all of your work done? Are you standing by on-call in case something goes wrong? Are you waiting on someone to deliver assets required for your next task? Do you lie about how long it takes to complete tasks? Honestly curious as I cannot remember a time where I had the free time to just screw around for any meaningful portion of my day.
  - JustSomeNobody 7y ago
    So you never find yourself working on a hard problem that you can't immediately solve, decide to get up and walk around to see who else is free then start talking for a bit before returning to your desk to find that your hard problem isn't so hard and now you have the solution? Of course, my problem is I WFH, so I end up talking to the kids stuffed animals. They don't really carry on good conversations.
    - momokoko 7y ago
      For sure. But that is working. I'm talking about all these stories of trying to prevent their boss from catching them playing games or surfing the web etc. If I did that I would fall way behind the work that needs to get done. That's why I wonder if maybe I'm missing something about other people's work days. Because, not only is it kind of sad, it also seems like actual criminal fraud to lie to people about what you are doing while they are paying to be doing something.
      - war1025 7y ago
        Assuming you are salaried, you are paid to solve problems, not run out the clock. Personally, I often have what I suppose you could think of as a "priority queue" of things going on in my head. Some of those may not be work related. If I have something "high priority" that I cannot get my mind off of, it is to everyone's benefit that I take care of that item so I can get on to work-related tasks. I think being distracted at work is not a "stick it to the man" activity for most people. It is just incredibly difficult to be actively providing value for a full work day. Humans need breaks. Same reason why there is the joke about construction crews always just sitting around. I've heard before as a criticism of Agile that "it's not a sprint, it's a marathon". I would take it even further: Being a professional isn't a marathon. It's a migration. You are going to be at this a very long time, and you need to go at a pace that you can sustain for years on end.
        momokoko 7y ago
        > It is just incredibly difficult to be actively providing value for a full work day. Then go home? Otherwise you are just lying to your employer and perpetuating a false pretense that their employees are being productive for a full day. If I'm not being productive and I can't finish any more work, I just go home. I don't sit there and lie about what I'm doing and pretend to be doing something I'm not. I should clarify that my issue is about faking it. Needing a boss button to hide what you were actually doing. Also, we all know that software developers are not really salaried employees. It was a loophole created after IBM lost a lawsuit. After some lobbying we were made explicitly exempt. So we really are just paid to "run out the clock". We are not managers or administrative people. We just do labor like any other tradesperson.
        war1025 7y ago
        You have an interesting view of the world. We must work under very different circumstances.
        momokoko 7y ago
  - crispinb 7y ago
    I have definitely had jobs where it would have been possible to do this. Largely due to clueless management, endemic to Australian business in my experience. It's such an old boys club, any duffer in a suit with a red enough face and sufficiently sport-versed beery brain remnants can run companies, and they have no idea what's going on 'beneath' them.
  - snazz 7y ago
    A lot of jobs (even as developers) in large companies have a positive correlation between butt in seat time and the perception of getting work done, but there usually isn’t enough work to do to fill the entire time. Most people work jobs that they aren’t truly passionate about.
    - momokoko 7y ago
      But again, why lie about it?
      - jacobush 7y ago
        To not embarrass everybody else who are also doing it, not least your boss.
        momokoko 7y ago
        Why would it be embarrassing to state "I currently have nothing to do right now, is there anything available I can help with." if you cannot figure out anything productive you could be doing on your own. Are people's managers actually saying to them, "Yes, there is nothing you can do right now, just sit in your seat and do nothing until I come get you"? I've never had that experience, and is why I'm asking about it.
        snazz 7y ago
        If you don’t enjoy your job, then it might be better to get done what is expected of you and enjoy the rest of the time you have to spend butt-in-chair doing something else, instead of intentionally piling more unenjoyable work on your platter. Especially if the manager isn’t technical: just don’t tell them you’re done and spend that time doing something else. Of course it completely depends on your work situation and the relationship with your manager, as well as how socially acceptable it is in your organization. I think lots of the people doing it had slacked off in high school and college and gotten away with it. Your relationship with your work and your time is probably much healthier, so I wouldn’t start screwing around during work hours now.
quickthrower2 7y ago
I think people screw around for a fraction of the day, as a break from coding all day. It might make you more efficient overall. A bit like HIIT training for 10km vs. sprinting 10km. Also if the work is getting done its probably OK. When you buy that $10/month plan from Netflix, do you want to know that someone was working hard (not slacking) for 10 minutes at $60/hr ... or do you want to reliably watch movies?
jpindar 7y ago
>How do these jobs continue to exist? Some businesses turn a profit. They don't need to rush to keep changing everything because they're already bringing in more money (from customers, not investors) than they spend.
prawn 7y ago
I know of a company where someone was getting away with napping for literally hours of the work day. One day, they went to nap in their usual secret spot to find that another employee was already asleep there. They did this for weeks. There was just that much fat in the business. Big profit margins and clueless management tiers.

whorleater 7y ago

I screw around at least 25% of the time as a dev

momokoko 7y ago
If you don't mind me asking, how do get all of your work done? Are you standing by on-call in case something goes wrong? Are you waiting on someone to deliver assets required for your next task? Do you lie about how long it takes to complete tasks? Honestly curious as I cannot remember a time where I had the free time to just screw around for any meaningful portion of my day.
- JustSomeNobody 7y ago
  So you never find yourself working on a hard problem that you can't immediately solve, decide to get up and walk around to see who else is free then start talking for a bit before returning to your desk to find that your hard problem isn't so hard and now you have the solution? Of course, my problem is I WFH, so I end up talking to the kids stuffed animals. They don't really carry on good conversations.
  - momokoko 7y ago
    For sure. But that is working. I'm talking about all these stories of trying to prevent their boss from catching them playing games or surfing the web etc. If I did that I would fall way behind the work that needs to get done. That's why I wonder if maybe I'm missing something about other people's work days. Because, not only is it kind of sad, it also seems like actual criminal fraud to lie to people about what you are doing while they are paying to be doing something.
    - war1025 7y ago
      Assuming you are salaried, you are paid to solve problems, not run out the clock. Personally, I often have what I suppose you could think of as a "priority queue" of things going on in my head. Some of those may not be work related. If I have something "high priority" that I cannot get my mind off of, it is to everyone's benefit that I take care of that item so I can get on to work-related tasks. I think being distracted at work is not a "stick it to the man" activity for most people. It is just incredibly difficult to be actively providing value for a full work day. Humans need breaks. Same reason why there is the joke about construction crews always just sitting around. I've heard before as a criticism of Agile that "it's not a sprint, it's a marathon". I would take it even further: Being a professional isn't a marathon. It's a migration. You are going to be at this a very long time, and you need to go at a pace that you can sustain for years on end.
      - momokoko 7y ago
        > It is just incredibly difficult to be actively providing value for a full work day. Then go home? Otherwise you are just lying to your employer and perpetuating a false pretense that their employees are being productive for a full day. If I'm not being productive and I can't finish any more work, I just go home. I don't sit there and lie about what I'm doing and pretend to be doing something I'm not. I should clarify that my issue is about faking it. Needing a boss button to hide what you were actually doing. Also, we all know that software developers are not really salaried employees. It was a loophole created after IBM lost a lawsuit. After some lobbying we were made explicitly exempt. So we really are just paid to "run out the clock". We are not managers or administrative people. We just do labor like any other tradesperson.
        war1025 7y ago
        You have an interesting view of the world. We must work under very different circumstances.
        momokoko 7y ago
- crispinb 7y ago
  I have definitely had jobs where it would have been possible to do this. Largely due to clueless management, endemic to Australian business in my experience. It's such an old boys club, any duffer in a suit with a red enough face and sufficiently sport-versed beery brain remnants can run companies, and they have no idea what's going on 'beneath' them.
- snazz 7y ago
  A lot of jobs (even as developers) in large companies have a positive correlation between butt in seat time and the perception of getting work done, but there usually isn’t enough work to do to fill the entire time. Most people work jobs that they aren’t truly passionate about.
  - momokoko 7y ago
    But again, why lie about it?
    - jacobush 7y ago
      To not embarrass everybody else who are also doing it, not least your boss.
      - momokoko 7y ago
        Why would it be embarrassing to state "I currently have nothing to do right now, is there anything available I can help with." if you cannot figure out anything productive you could be doing on your own. Are people's managers actually saying to them, "Yes, there is nothing you can do right now, just sit in your seat and do nothing until I come get you"? I've never had that experience, and is why I'm asking about it.
        snazz 7y ago
        If you don’t enjoy your job, then it might be better to get done what is expected of you and enjoy the rest of the time you have to spend butt-in-chair doing something else, instead of intentionally piling more unenjoyable work on your platter. Especially if the manager isn’t technical: just don’t tell them you’re done and spend that time doing something else. Of course it completely depends on your work situation and the relationship with your manager, as well as how socially acceptable it is in your organization. I think lots of the people doing it had slacked off in high school and college and gotten away with it. Your relationship with your work and your time is probably much healthier, so I wouldn’t start screwing around during work hours now.

quickthrower2 7y ago

I think people screw around for a fraction of the day, as a break from coding all day. It might make you more efficient overall. A bit like HIIT training for 10km vs. sprinting 10km. Also if the work is getting done its probably OK. When you buy that $10/month plan from Netflix, do you want to know that someone was working hard (not slacking) for 10 minutes at $60/hr ... or do you want to reliably watch movies?

jpindar 7y ago

>How do these jobs continue to exist? Some businesses turn a profit. They don't need to rush to keep changing everything because they're already bringing in more money (from customers, not investors) than they spend.

prawn 7y ago

I know of a company where someone was getting away with napping for literally hours of the work day. One day, they went to nap in their usual secret spot to find that another employee was already asleep there. They did this for weeks. There was just that much fat in the business. Big profit margins and clueless management tiers.