4 ms·

Canada really needs to start developing the north properly, what with global warming and all.

by fouc 7y ago

grecy 7y ago
Ontario transfers $1 billion a year to the Yukon for exactly the kind of Development you're talking about. It's growing and expanding just as the government wants it to.
- dear 7y ago
  Better not use that $1B to buy Huawei stuff.
  - aclsid 7y ago
    Why? I'm honestly bothered by this Cold War mentality that has settled in people due to the amount of repetition that Huawei somehow is doing something bad yet no single piece of evidence has come out to support those claims. Restricting competition by using FUD is nothing new to the Linux community, but seeing this being done at the govt level and people buying into this whole tribal mentality is astonishing. I have more issues with some monopolistic tendencies that companies like Google or Microsoft in the 90s had, especially with how Android is effectively becoming closed source through the Play Store and Services, yet you do not see that level of collective paranoia going on.
    - dear 7y ago
      >Why? I'm honestly bothered by this Cold War mentality... You should direct this question to China instead.
- jeromegv 7y ago
  You mean Ottawa? Because the province of Ontario is not contributing to the territory of Yukon.
  - anewguy9000 7y ago
    Equalization payments: "do not, technically, involve wealthy provinces making payments to poor provinces, although in practice this is what happens, via the federal treasury." https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equalization_payments https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equalization_payments
    - peeters 7y ago
      This is NOT in practice what happens. This way of framing it is popular by separatist segments in Alberta, but it's bullshit. Transfer payments come out of federal tax levies. No province is being targeted for levies. If one province has richer people and thus pay more in federal tax, then yes they will likely have a net loss in transfer payments. But this is no different than ANY federal service, whether it comes to military bases, natural resources, child care benefits, etc. It's simply how taxes work. If you're a poor person in Alberta you're paying less into equalization than a rich person in Quebec.
      - rdlecler1 7y ago
        Except that Quebec has additional social services that are being paid for by these levies. Child care for example. Also revenue from high income taxes often come with increased prices for residents so while two people may pay similar taxes between the provinces they can have vastly different standards of living. Not unlike here in SF where you can easily pay $35k/year in taxes and you’re barely getting by while people in other cities are paying far less taxes and they own their own homes.
      - sdfasdfsafasf 7y ago
        That's exactly what happens via the unequal distribution of federal income to the provinces. We can argue that it's a good thing the program works the way it does and I'd argue, for the most part, that's true [0]. But all the programs you listed and the eq. program are net transfers from rich (and less politically powerful [1]) to poorer provinces. It's akin to when coastal Americans bemoan that fly over Americans get net transfer of wealth from them. [0]having lived in many US states, I kinda like knowing that NL, or NB is taken care of when they're in the dumps [1] Being a 905er myself, let's be honest here! Quebec, between separatism and as a battleground province, can throw a hissy fit and get whatever they want (and good for them! Hate the game, not the player.)
skocznymroczny 7y ago
Yes, I think the "heats up" in the title was very inappropriate. The humanity will likely collapse within 10 years and all we worry about is our internet speeds.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- ttraub 7y ago
  Don't you mean "appropriate"? If global climate is heating up, people will naturally move northwards in Canada and Siberia to take advantage of newly fertile farmland and moderate temps.
  - SketchySeaBeast 7y ago
    > people will naturally move northwards in Canada and Siberia to take advantage of newly fertile farmland Is this the early 1900's? Farming these days doesn't require a large population - the day of family farms are few and far between. You need comparatively few people to farm an extraordinarily large area of land, so I can't see a reason why people would want to all move there for an industry they largely won't take part in. I also doubt the moderate temperatures bit - while the average temperature will go up it will be subject to all sorts of radical weather, made more extreme by the atmospheres additional energy, and without the oceans to try and mitigate the temperature. I'm sure there will still be cold winters - moving the dial up an average of 5 C still sees the average January Fort McMurray day with a high of -5 C and a low of -17 C.
    - freeone3000 7y ago
      Also, Fort McMurray isn't North - it's 10 degrees latitude south and twenty degrees C warmer than Ilaquit.
      - SketchySeaBeast 7y ago
        That too - people think of the oil being in the "north", but it's not, if you look at the map, it's only a 3rd of the way north of the US/Canada border.
frenchyatwork 7y ago
A lot of our north is what is known as the Canadian Shield. It's very bad to develop on, and global warming will only do a little bit to improve that.
- stallmanite 7y ago
  I just read the Wikipedia article on the Canadian Shield but it’s not immediately obvious to me why it would be bad to develop on. Is it the thin topsoil basically?

Canada really needs to start developing the north properly, what with global warming and all.

by fouc 7y ago

Canada really needs to start developing the north properly, what with global warming and all.

Ontario transfers $1 billion a year to the Yukon for exactly the kind of Development you're talking about. It's growing and expanding just as the government wants it to.

dear 7y ago
Better not use that $1B to buy Huawei stuff.
- aclsid 7y ago
  Why? I'm honestly bothered by this Cold War mentality that has settled in people due to the amount of repetition that Huawei somehow is doing something bad yet no single piece of evidence has come out to support those claims. Restricting competition by using FUD is nothing new to the Linux community, but seeing this being done at the govt level and people buying into this whole tribal mentality is astonishing. I have more issues with some monopolistic tendencies that companies like Google or Microsoft in the 90s had, especially with how Android is effectively becoming closed source through the Play Store and Services, yet you do not see that level of collective paranoia going on.
  - dear 7y ago
    >Why? I'm honestly bothered by this Cold War mentality... You should direct this question to China instead.
jeromegv 7y ago
You mean Ottawa? Because the province of Ontario is not contributing to the territory of Yukon.
- anewguy9000 7y ago
  Equalization payments: "do not, technically, involve wealthy provinces making payments to poor provinces, although in practice this is what happens, via the federal treasury." https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equalization_payments https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equalization_payments
  - peeters 7y ago
    This is NOT in practice what happens. This way of framing it is popular by separatist segments in Alberta, but it's bullshit. Transfer payments come out of federal tax levies. No province is being targeted for levies. If one province has richer people and thus pay more in federal tax, then yes they will likely have a net loss in transfer payments. But this is no different than ANY federal service, whether it comes to military bases, natural resources, child care benefits, etc. It's simply how taxes work. If you're a poor person in Alberta you're paying less into equalization than a rich person in Quebec.
    - rdlecler1 7y ago
      Except that Quebec has additional social services that are being paid for by these levies. Child care for example. Also revenue from high income taxes often come with increased prices for residents so while two people may pay similar taxes between the provinces they can have vastly different standards of living. Not unlike here in SF where you can easily pay $35k/year in taxes and you’re barely getting by while people in other cities are paying far less taxes and they own their own homes.
    - sdfasdfsafasf 7y ago
      That's exactly what happens via the unequal distribution of federal income to the provinces. We can argue that it's a good thing the program works the way it does and I'd argue, for the most part, that's true [0]. But all the programs you listed and the eq. program are net transfers from rich (and less politically powerful [1]) to poorer provinces. It's akin to when coastal Americans bemoan that fly over Americans get net transfer of wealth from them. [0]having lived in many US states, I kinda like knowing that NL, or NB is taken care of when they're in the dumps [1] Being a 905er myself, let's be honest here! Quebec, between separatism and as a battleground province, can throw a hissy fit and get whatever they want (and good for them! Hate the game, not the player.)

skocznymroczny 7y ago

Yes, I think the "heats up" in the title was very inappropriate. The humanity will likely collapse within 10 years and all we worry about is our internet speeds.

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
ttraub 7y ago
Don't you mean "appropriate"? If global climate is heating up, people will naturally move northwards in Canada and Siberia to take advantage of newly fertile farmland and moderate temps.
- SketchySeaBeast 7y ago
  > people will naturally move northwards in Canada and Siberia to take advantage of newly fertile farmland Is this the early 1900's? Farming these days doesn't require a large population - the day of family farms are few and far between. You need comparatively few people to farm an extraordinarily large area of land, so I can't see a reason why people would want to all move there for an industry they largely won't take part in. I also doubt the moderate temperatures bit - while the average temperature will go up it will be subject to all sorts of radical weather, made more extreme by the atmospheres additional energy, and without the oceans to try and mitigate the temperature. I'm sure there will still be cold winters - moving the dial up an average of 5 C still sees the average January Fort McMurray day with a high of -5 C and a low of -17 C.
  - freeone3000 7y ago
    Also, Fort McMurray isn't North - it's 10 degrees latitude south and twenty degrees C warmer than Ilaquit.
    - SketchySeaBeast 7y ago
      That too - people think of the oil being in the "north", but it's not, if you look at the map, it's only a 3rd of the way north of the US/Canada border.

frenchyatwork 7y ago

A lot of our north is what is known as the Canadian Shield. It's very bad to develop on, and global warming will only do a little bit to improve that.

stallmanite 7y ago
I just read the Wikipedia article on the Canadian Shield but it’s not immediately obvious to me why it would be bad to develop on. Is it the thin topsoil basically?