4 ms·

Well, I'm sure if this catches on more, China will ask respective App stores to block this app.

by yumraj 7y ago

lucb1e 7y ago
It also doesn't seem like rocket science to scan for these Bluetooth signals. If you're part of a mesh, the police can also join and hone in on participants.
- RcouF1uZ4gsC 7y ago
  Not just join, but actively disrupt by spreading false messages.
  - anigbrowl 7y ago
    Not so easily. There's still social signaling, as exemplified best by this amusing meme: https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/how-do-you-do-fellow-kids https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/how-do-you-do-fellow-kids
- anigbrowl 7y ago
  Using an app by itself isn't probative of anything, and homing in on half the people in a large crowd isn't effective.
marrone12 7y ago
Yes, I don't know how they can call it unblockable, since it's quite easy to block apps from app stores.
- lucb1e 7y ago
  It's also quite easy to install an apk.
  - yumraj 7y ago
    How about iOS?
    - lucb1e 7y ago
      Yeah if you choose for a locked platform, you're out of luck if you get locked out.
      - yumraj 7y ago
        Unfortunately that's a sophie's choice. A locked but privacy respecting platform vs a no-privacy but open platform.
        lucb1e 7y ago
        I don't know about "no privacy" when you can install (perhaps except for a few drivers, depending on which hardware you fancy) a FOSS environment. I see where you are coming from and as a non-USA citizen I hate the Google integration as much as you probably do, but if this is the kind of thing you care about, Android is the free platform that gives you all the options. Those who say that iOS is more supportive of privacy... by default (if privacy is not important enough to you to follow a tutorial to install a clean OS), then sure, but when it really matters and you need to have control over your device, Apple just doesn't allow you to do that. But let me repeat: I do see where you are coming from. Apple does a bunch more things right on this front than Android (again, speaking about manufacturers' defaults) and a lot of non-technical people would find it hard to even follow the step by step instructions that are available. I'm not sure there is an absolute right or wrong answer in the general case. I'm just saying that for the specific case of people that (need to) care about this, Android is at least an open platform with a (tiny, tiny) FOSS ecosystem.
- app4soft 7y ago
  Government can't block apps that could be transferred from one device to another via Bluetooth/WiFi. iOS/Apple devices are bad in this case; Android would be much better choice for organizing such meshes. Also, F-Droid.org is safe place for Android users.
  - snazz 7y ago
    F-Droid includes a feature to get apps over Bluetooth.
    - 29083011397778 7y ago
      I did a quick search for the app named in the article when it was first posted and didn't see it listed on F-Droid. I was actually surprised the protesters were using something closed-source.
- atoav 7y ago
  Which doesn’t block any existing connection.
kccqzy 7y ago
Hong Kong is a separate region in the Apple App Store and I imagine Play Store as well. China does not normally have anything to do with the Hong Kong app stores but if they do, that'd be extremely bad PR and would likely fuel even more protests, achieving the opposite goal of suppressing the protests.
- zoom6628 7y ago
  FYI Play Store not accessible directly. There are many many app stores and one can frequently get access to other apk serving sites from China. I wont mention them directly for obvious reasons.
jeffnappi 7y ago
The fact you even mention this is evidence that Restrictive/Exclusive App Stores (e.g. Apple App Store) are a bad deal for consumers - limiting their privacy, and freedom. No entity should be able to block you from running software of your choice on a device you own. Fortunately the majority of these protestors are likely using Android devices with the easy ability to put them in developer mode and side load these messaging apps. I'd like to see Apple iOS introduce a developer mode (free of cost!) that allows side loading.
- avh02 7y ago
  The problem with sideloading is the threat of compromised/modified version of an app being unknowingly installed. I believe the Saudis did this with the help of an Italian company whose name escapes me right now. Edit: looked it up, here: https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/ypw3xv/police-grade-mobile-spyware-is-spreading-through-saudi-arabia-and-beyond https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/ypw3xv/police-grade-mobil...
  - jeffnappi 7y ago
    Sideloading is certainly risky, but it isn't something that a device manufacturer should be able to prevent a device owner from choosing to do. If you are sideloading an app, you should verify the source of it and you should be aware of the potential security risks you are taking. Preferably side loaded apps you might install are open source and the binaries are verifiable.

Well, I'm sure if this catches on more, China will ask respective App stores to block this app.

by yumraj 7y ago

Well, I'm sure if this catches on more, China will ask respective App stores to block this app.

It also doesn't seem like rocket science to scan for these Bluetooth signals. If you're part of a mesh, the police can also join and hone in on participants.

RcouF1uZ4gsC 7y ago
Not just join, but actively disrupt by spreading false messages.
- anigbrowl 7y ago
  Not so easily. There's still social signaling, as exemplified best by this amusing meme: https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/how-do-you-do-fellow-kids https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/how-do-you-do-fellow-kids
anigbrowl 7y ago
Using an app by itself isn't probative of anything, and homing in on half the people in a large crowd isn't effective.

marrone12 7y ago

Yes, I don't know how they can call it unblockable, since it's quite easy to block apps from app stores.

lucb1e 7y ago
It's also quite easy to install an apk.
- yumraj 7y ago
  How about iOS?
  - lucb1e 7y ago
    Yeah if you choose for a locked platform, you're out of luck if you get locked out.
    - yumraj 7y ago
      Unfortunately that's a sophie's choice. A locked but privacy respecting platform vs a no-privacy but open platform.
      - lucb1e 7y ago
        I don't know about "no privacy" when you can install (perhaps except for a few drivers, depending on which hardware you fancy) a FOSS environment. I see where you are coming from and as a non-USA citizen I hate the Google integration as much as you probably do, but if this is the kind of thing you care about, Android is the free platform that gives you all the options. Those who say that iOS is more supportive of privacy... by default (if privacy is not important enough to you to follow a tutorial to install a clean OS), then sure, but when it really matters and you need to have control over your device, Apple just doesn't allow you to do that. But let me repeat: I do see where you are coming from. Apple does a bunch more things right on this front than Android (again, speaking about manufacturers' defaults) and a lot of non-technical people would find it hard to even follow the step by step instructions that are available. I'm not sure there is an absolute right or wrong answer in the general case. I'm just saying that for the specific case of people that (need to) care about this, Android is at least an open platform with a (tiny, tiny) FOSS ecosystem.
app4soft 7y ago
Government can't block apps that could be transferred from one device to another via Bluetooth/WiFi. iOS/Apple devices are bad in this case; Android would be much better choice for organizing such meshes. Also, F-Droid.org is safe place for Android users.
- snazz 7y ago
  F-Droid includes a feature to get apps over Bluetooth.
  - 29083011397778 7y ago
    I did a quick search for the app named in the article when it was first posted and didn't see it listed on F-Droid. I was actually surprised the protesters were using something closed-source.
atoav 7y ago
Which doesn’t block any existing connection.

kccqzy 7y ago

Hong Kong is a separate region in the Apple App Store and I imagine Play Store as well. China does not normally have anything to do with the Hong Kong app stores but if they do, that'd be extremely bad PR and would likely fuel even more protests, achieving the opposite goal of suppressing the protests.

zoom6628 7y ago
FYI Play Store not accessible directly. There are many many app stores and one can frequently get access to other apk serving sites from China. I wont mention them directly for obvious reasons.

jeffnappi 7y ago

The fact you even mention this is evidence that Restrictive/Exclusive App Stores (e.g. Apple App Store) are a bad deal for consumers - limiting their privacy, and freedom. No entity should be able to block you from running software of your choice on a device you own. Fortunately the majority of these protestors are likely using Android devices with the easy ability to put them in developer mode and side load these messaging apps. I'd like to see Apple iOS introduce a developer mode (free of cost!) that allows side loading.

avh02 7y ago
The problem with sideloading is the threat of compromised/modified version of an app being unknowingly installed. I believe the Saudis did this with the help of an Italian company whose name escapes me right now. Edit: looked it up, here: https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/ypw3xv/police-grade-mobile-spyware-is-spreading-through-saudi-arabia-and-beyond https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/ypw3xv/police-grade-mobil...
- jeffnappi 7y ago
  Sideloading is certainly risky, but it isn't something that a device manufacturer should be able to prevent a device owner from choosing to do. If you are sideloading an app, you should verify the source of it and you should be aware of the potential security risks you are taking. Preferably side loaded apps you might install are open source and the binaries are verifiable.