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HN yesterday: suburbs are evil! Drain on society! Move to the cities! HN today: hey you guys know you can get 2700sq ft on 2 acres for half of what your studio

HN yesterday: suburbs are evil! Drain on society! Move to the cities! HN today: hey you guys know you can get 2700sq ft on 2 acres for half of what your studio costs right?

epx 7y ago
Let's not confuse a suburb with a smaller city. I live in a 500k hab city, that's the hard limit for me. But it is a fully functional city, not an island of houses; I don't have to drive 16km to buy groceries.
rocqua 7y ago
There is a difference between suburbs and living in the core of mid-sized cities. Besides, HN is more than one person, with different views.
jfk13 7y ago
There's a big difference between moving to the suburbs and moving to a small town.
- dragonwriter 7y ago
  > There's a big difference between moving to the suburbs and moving to a small town. “Small town” and “suburb” are overlapping categories, and if it's in the former category but also lets you work in a big city (so that what you can afford on the same salary is relevant), it's almost certainly also in the latter category.
  - lotsofpulp 7y ago
    I think people need a way to differentiate between the concrete 5 lane highway and parking lot requirements that make it impossible to walk anywhere, versus towns with small roads and businesses spread out that one can walk around easily. I would interpret the word suburb to describe an area where you must use a car to get around and walking is not an option, versus a small town where you don't need a car and can walk around to do most routine activities.
    - dragonwriter 7y ago
      > I would interpret the word suburb to describe an area where you must use a car to get around and walking is not an option, versus a small town where you don't need a car and can walk around to do most routine activities. The problem with this binary division is that plenty of real communities outside of metropolitan coresñ.ñ would be a blend of “small town” and “suburb” by this description, varying on a continuum between being nearly purely “small town” in their local core (which might or might not be styled as a “downtown”) to pure “suburb” as you get further from that core.
simonebrunozzi 7y ago
Suburbs of a big city != small city
- sudosteph 7y ago
  This. I moved from Downtown Seattle to Downtown Raleigh with a remote job, and cut my rent in half without changing driving or living patterns significantly. My husband and I still share 1 car which gets used 2-3 times a month for trips to nearby cities/beaches/mountains (Charlotte, Wilmington, Asheville), and then otherwise we walk to cafes, bars, restaurants and corner stores, even my doctor and dentist are only a short walk away. There are not many parts of Raleigh where you can do this, and it's still more expensive than suburb living out here. But I find that I have equal or better access to the stuff I actually want and use, so I don't feel like I sacrificed much.
eherot 7y ago
Suburbs ARE evil, but our land use policies keep us from building enough housing in cities, which makes them too expensive to be considered a good option for most people.
- ajmurmann 7y ago
  Can someone who downvoted this please explain their reasoning?
  - Krustopolis 7y ago
    I didn't downvote it, but it's likely due to the unsubstantiated claim that suburbs are evil or the sweeping generalization that all cities have poor zoning and land use planning. Or perhaps the biased implication that large cities are good for everyone.
fiblye 7y ago
If you're living in a suburb and working remotely, it's a pretty good deal. You're not burning gas to get to work and you get to enjoy some space. I think the biggest evil of suburbs is the commute. I think part of the reason there's no social activity in suburbs is because, honestly, who wants to do anything after spending an hour in traffic after getting off your 8-5 job and knowing you need to be out the door by 6:30 the next day?
- im3w1l 7y ago
  > there's no social activity in suburbs I find that hard to believe.
  - lwhalen 7y ago
    It's literally not zoned for it. Change the zoning laws to at least allow for a local pub or coffee shop in the middle of a residential area, that would be a positive step in the right direction IMHO.
    - freddie_mercury 7y ago
      I mean I kind of agree with your point about zoning but you realize that your chosen examples make you look like a single, childless 20something and thus somewhat out of touch with what a lot of people consider socializing? I don't like to suburbs either but I'm currently visiting my brother who lives in one. Their socializing is kids basketball & soccer games at the park (which suburbs are zoned for), picnics at the local greenway (also zoned for), and swimming in the community pool. All of which are walking distance. Not to mention, you know, inviting people over to their house because it isn't a tiny 400 square foot apartment. They make dinner for friends and watch football on the porch.
      - lwhalen 7y ago
        Late 30s, father, just not "urban". The best layout I've seen was in Amsterdam - every neighborhood had it's own local pub, local coffeehouse, and small grocery, all eminently walkable/bikeable. Neighbors knew each other and socialized regularly. The "small town feel" was nailed pretty well, IMHO, while still being in a bustling urban center.
marvin 7y ago
Yesterday, or at least when I remember the craze of moving from suburbs to the city, city real estate cost around 50% of what it does today. Property costs have inflated a lot alongside the popularity of living more concentrated. So it stands to reason that the pendulum now swings the other way. People are very good at sussing out the economics of a trend that used to be profitable but no longer is.
king_magic 7y ago
Not everyone wants to live in a dystopian nightmare crush of cars and people.

HN yesterday: suburbs are evil! Drain on society! Move to the cities! HN today: hey you guys know you can get 2700sq ft on 2 acres for half of what your studio costs right?

epx 7y ago

Let's not confuse a suburb with a smaller city. I live in a 500k hab city, that's the hard limit for me. But it is a fully functional city, not an island of houses; I don't have to drive 16km to buy groceries.

rocqua 7y ago

There is a difference between suburbs and living in the core of mid-sized cities. Besides, HN is more than one person, with different views.

jfk13 7y ago

There's a big difference between moving to the suburbs and moving to a small town.

dragonwriter 7y ago
> There's a big difference between moving to the suburbs and moving to a small town. “Small town” and “suburb” are overlapping categories, and if it's in the former category but also lets you work in a big city (so that what you can afford on the same salary is relevant), it's almost certainly also in the latter category.
- lotsofpulp 7y ago
  I think people need a way to differentiate between the concrete 5 lane highway and parking lot requirements that make it impossible to walk anywhere, versus towns with small roads and businesses spread out that one can walk around easily. I would interpret the word suburb to describe an area where you must use a car to get around and walking is not an option, versus a small town where you don't need a car and can walk around to do most routine activities.
  - dragonwriter 7y ago
    > I would interpret the word suburb to describe an area where you must use a car to get around and walking is not an option, versus a small town where you don't need a car and can walk around to do most routine activities. The problem with this binary division is that plenty of real communities outside of metropolitan coresñ.ñ would be a blend of “small town” and “suburb” by this description, varying on a continuum between being nearly purely “small town” in their local core (which might or might not be styled as a “downtown”) to pure “suburb” as you get further from that core.

simonebrunozzi 7y ago

Suburbs of a big city != small city

sudosteph 7y ago
This. I moved from Downtown Seattle to Downtown Raleigh with a remote job, and cut my rent in half without changing driving or living patterns significantly. My husband and I still share 1 car which gets used 2-3 times a month for trips to nearby cities/beaches/mountains (Charlotte, Wilmington, Asheville), and then otherwise we walk to cafes, bars, restaurants and corner stores, even my doctor and dentist are only a short walk away. There are not many parts of Raleigh where you can do this, and it's still more expensive than suburb living out here. But I find that I have equal or better access to the stuff I actually want and use, so I don't feel like I sacrificed much.

eherot 7y ago

Suburbs ARE evil, but our land use policies keep us from building enough housing in cities, which makes them too expensive to be considered a good option for most people.

ajmurmann 7y ago
Can someone who downvoted this please explain their reasoning?
- Krustopolis 7y ago
  I didn't downvote it, but it's likely due to the unsubstantiated claim that suburbs are evil or the sweeping generalization that all cities have poor zoning and land use planning. Or perhaps the biased implication that large cities are good for everyone.

fiblye 7y ago

If you're living in a suburb and working remotely, it's a pretty good deal. You're not burning gas to get to work and you get to enjoy some space. I think the biggest evil of suburbs is the commute. I think part of the reason there's no social activity in suburbs is because, honestly, who wants to do anything after spending an hour in traffic after getting off your 8-5 job and knowing you need to be out the door by 6:30 the next day?

im3w1l 7y ago
> there's no social activity in suburbs I find that hard to believe.
- lwhalen 7y ago
  It's literally not zoned for it. Change the zoning laws to at least allow for a local pub or coffee shop in the middle of a residential area, that would be a positive step in the right direction IMHO.
  - freddie_mercury 7y ago
    I mean I kind of agree with your point about zoning but you realize that your chosen examples make you look like a single, childless 20something and thus somewhat out of touch with what a lot of people consider socializing? I don't like to suburbs either but I'm currently visiting my brother who lives in one. Their socializing is kids basketball & soccer games at the park (which suburbs are zoned for), picnics at the local greenway (also zoned for), and swimming in the community pool. All of which are walking distance. Not to mention, you know, inviting people over to their house because it isn't a tiny 400 square foot apartment. They make dinner for friends and watch football on the porch.
    - lwhalen 7y ago
      Late 30s, father, just not "urban". The best layout I've seen was in Amsterdam - every neighborhood had it's own local pub, local coffeehouse, and small grocery, all eminently walkable/bikeable. Neighbors knew each other and socialized regularly. The "small town feel" was nailed pretty well, IMHO, while still being in a bustling urban center.

marvin 7y ago

Yesterday, or at least when I remember the craze of moving from suburbs to the city, city real estate cost around 50% of what it does today. Property costs have inflated a lot alongside the popularity of living more concentrated. So it stands to reason that the pendulum now swings the other way. People are very good at sussing out the economics of a trend that used to be profitable but no longer is.

king_magic 7y ago

Not everyone wants to live in a dystopian nightmare crush of cars and people.