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Two other LSD targets of the CIA's program weren't mentioned in this excerpt. You've probably heard of them: Ted Kaczynski Charles Manson It is possible that

Two other LSD targets of the CIA's program weren't mentioned in this excerpt. You've probably heard of them: Ted Kaczynski Charles Manson It is possible that neither would have committed their crimes but for their involvement in the CIA's mind experimentation programs. See, O'Neill, Chaos: Charles Manson, the CIA and the Secret History of the Sixties (2019).

FakeComments 7y ago
One has to wonder if MK Ultra and similar were actually a net positive. The CIA guy pitches it as defending the country, but it seems more like defending the egos and delusions of the team involved.
cheez 7y ago
Kinda makes you think about all the shooters "known to federal authorities" recently.
- trhway 7y ago
  speaking about famous shooters, the MKULTRA doctors just happened to be around: https://www.muckrock.com/news/archives/2017/dec/19/mkruby/ https://www.muckrock.com/news/archives/2017/dec/19/mkruby/ "After he shot Lee Harvey Oswald, Jack Ruby’s psychosis was diagnosed by the same CIA doctor who had once killed an elephant with psychedelics" The same doctor happened to be around in the context of Charles Manson too : https://longreads.com/2019/06/27/a-manson-murder-investigation-20-years-in-the-making-there-are-still-secrets/ https://longreads.com/2019/06/27/a-manson-murder-investigati... "I could show that he was working out of the [Haight-Ashbury Free] clinic recruiting subjects for his research at the same time Manson was bringing the women in to see his parole officer there, but I was trying to get them in the same room. I felt like everything that Manson did with his women was exactly what the CIA was trying to do with people without their knowledge, in the exact same time, at the exact same place. West had a history of doing research in inducing insanity without a person’s awareness. He reported that he had learned how to replace true memories with false ones. And he saw Jack Ruby [who shot JFK’s killer, Lee Harvey Oswald, in 1963] within the 24 hours that Ruby became insane."
  - ryacko 7y ago
    That same CIA doctor went on to perform a necropsy on the elephant /while/ on LSD.
  - cheez 7y ago
    Sheesh, that is terrifying...
    - RyanAF7 7y ago
      Horton Hears a ... color named doctor
    - blattimwind 7y ago
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unethical_human_experimentation_in_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unethical_human_experimentatio...
seppin 7y ago
Source?
- draw_down 7y ago
  Oh my god, GP literally mentions the source at the end of the comment! Come on!
- rixed 7y ago
  > See, O'Neill, Chaos: Charles Manson, the CIA and the Secret History of the Sixties (2019).
  - seppin 7y ago
    That book is about the FBI's involvement, not the CIA
033803throwaway 7y ago
Interesting that psychedelics are being pushed by elites via popular media like Joe Rogan, etc.
- boomboomsubban 7y ago
  It's unclear if Kaczynski received any psychedelics. What we know is that he faced hundreds of hours of intense personal abuse including belittling his hopes for the future. Nobody is pushing that. I haven't heard Manson's story on the issue, but he would have already spent a decade incarcerated before they did anything.
  - RyanAF7 7y ago
    Yes, and he underwent said abuse at Harvard by a doctor named Henry Murray who was apart of the division that created MKUltra/MKSEARCH and who had previously administered LSD to unwitting patients. Lets get real, when your goal is complete ego control, all forms of mindfucking are on the table. Also, almost all of the MK Ultra files were destroyed. So what people know is residual and stories from guilt ridden scientists and abused people.
- detritus 7y ago
  'pushed by elites'?
arminiusreturns 7y ago
Another one not many people know about, but will usually recognize the name instantly: Whitey Bulger [1] 1. https://knowledgenuts.com/2013/11/17/mobster-whitey-bulger-underwent-cia-mind-control-experiments/ https://knowledgenuts.com/2013/11/17/mobster-whitey-bulger-u...
- defen 7y ago
  Not a criminal, but another very influential person, Ken Kesey, was involved with MKULTRA as well.
krilly 7y ago
To my knowledge Ted Kaczynskis experiences with MKultra didn't involve any substances. He just sat in a chair while some folks screamed at him trying to aggressively undermine all of his views.
- keiru 7y ago
  Professional lawyers posing as peers psychologically tortuting him to shatter his worldview, while the professor that led the experiment manipulated him to continue. Given that he secluded himself and wrote about his ideology for years like a comic book villain origin story, it's safe to say they took to too far, whatever it is they did. Also, afaik MK tested lacing with different doses, and only the big incidents were disclosed. Why wouldn't you suspect drugging here too?
  - wallace_f 7y ago
    I wonder if there is even anything one could do in that kind of situation to have a normal life. Edit: I also think this kind of thing exists in society today, but probably bought and sold on exclusive markets to modern lords and ladies.
    - solotronics 7y ago
      Wait, what?
      - wallace_f 7y ago
        If someone shared outright that they'd had similar experiences, few people would believe them.
        ColanR 7y ago
        > I also think this kind of thing exists in society today, but probably bought and sold on exclusive markets to modern lords and ladies. Can you elaborate? I don't know what you're referring to.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]

FakeComments 7y ago

One has to wonder if MK Ultra and similar were actually a net positive. The CIA guy pitches it as defending the country, but it seems more like defending the egos and delusions of the team involved.

cheez 7y ago

Kinda makes you think about all the shooters "known to federal authorities" recently.

trhway 7y ago
speaking about famous shooters, the MKULTRA doctors just happened to be around: https://www.muckrock.com/news/archives/2017/dec/19/mkruby/ https://www.muckrock.com/news/archives/2017/dec/19/mkruby/ "After he shot Lee Harvey Oswald, Jack Ruby’s psychosis was diagnosed by the same CIA doctor who had once killed an elephant with psychedelics" The same doctor happened to be around in the context of Charles Manson too : https://longreads.com/2019/06/27/a-manson-murder-investigation-20-years-in-the-making-there-are-still-secrets/ https://longreads.com/2019/06/27/a-manson-murder-investigati... "I could show that he was working out of the [Haight-Ashbury Free] clinic recruiting subjects for his research at the same time Manson was bringing the women in to see his parole officer there, but I was trying to get them in the same room. I felt like everything that Manson did with his women was exactly what the CIA was trying to do with people without their knowledge, in the exact same time, at the exact same place. West had a history of doing research in inducing insanity without a person’s awareness. He reported that he had learned how to replace true memories with false ones. And he saw Jack Ruby [who shot JFK’s killer, Lee Harvey Oswald, in 1963] within the 24 hours that Ruby became insane."
- ryacko 7y ago
  That same CIA doctor went on to perform a necropsy on the elephant /while/ on LSD.
- cheez 7y ago
  Sheesh, that is terrifying...
  - RyanAF7 7y ago
    Horton Hears a ... color named doctor
  - blattimwind 7y ago
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unethical_human_experimentation_in_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unethical_human_experimentatio...

seppin 7y ago

Source?

draw_down 7y ago
Oh my god, GP literally mentions the source at the end of the comment! Come on!
rixed 7y ago
> See, O'Neill, Chaos: Charles Manson, the CIA and the Secret History of the Sixties (2019).
- seppin 7y ago
  That book is about the FBI's involvement, not the CIA

033803throwaway 7y ago

Interesting that psychedelics are being pushed by elites via popular media like Joe Rogan, etc.

boomboomsubban 7y ago
It's unclear if Kaczynski received any psychedelics. What we know is that he faced hundreds of hours of intense personal abuse including belittling his hopes for the future. Nobody is pushing that. I haven't heard Manson's story on the issue, but he would have already spent a decade incarcerated before they did anything.
- RyanAF7 7y ago
  Yes, and he underwent said abuse at Harvard by a doctor named Henry Murray who was apart of the division that created MKUltra/MKSEARCH and who had previously administered LSD to unwitting patients. Lets get real, when your goal is complete ego control, all forms of mindfucking are on the table. Also, almost all of the MK Ultra files were destroyed. So what people know is residual and stories from guilt ridden scientists and abused people.
detritus 7y ago
'pushed by elites'?

arminiusreturns 7y ago

Another one not many people know about, but will usually recognize the name instantly: Whitey Bulger [1] 1. https://knowledgenuts.com/2013/11/17/mobster-whitey-bulger-underwent-cia-mind-control-experiments/ https://knowledgenuts.com/2013/11/17/mobster-whitey-bulger-u...

defen 7y ago
Not a criminal, but another very influential person, Ken Kesey, was involved with MKULTRA as well.

krilly 7y ago

To my knowledge Ted Kaczynskis experiences with MKultra didn't involve any substances. He just sat in a chair while some folks screamed at him trying to aggressively undermine all of his views.

keiru 7y ago
Professional lawyers posing as peers psychologically tortuting him to shatter his worldview, while the professor that led the experiment manipulated him to continue. Given that he secluded himself and wrote about his ideology for years like a comic book villain origin story, it's safe to say they took to too far, whatever it is they did. Also, afaik MK tested lacing with different doses, and only the big incidents were disclosed. Why wouldn't you suspect drugging here too?
- wallace_f 7y ago
  I wonder if there is even anything one could do in that kind of situation to have a normal life. Edit: I also think this kind of thing exists in society today, but probably bought and sold on exclusive markets to modern lords and ladies.
  - solotronics 7y ago
    Wait, what?
    - wallace_f 7y ago
      If someone shared outright that they'd had similar experiences, few people would believe them.
      - ColanR 7y ago
        > I also think this kind of thing exists in society today, but probably bought and sold on exclusive markets to modern lords and ladies. Can you elaborate? I don't know what you're referring to.

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]