4 ms·

I know its not hard for anyone to find flaws in the certain kind of people that become Internet trolls, but... Sure, the church died. Car meets, bars, video ga

I know its not hard for anyone to find flaws in the certain kind of people that become Internet trolls, but... Sure, the church died. Car meets, bars, video game tournaments, rock concerts, so many events these men could fit into are happening every week in your city/near your campus. But because Timmy the Internet troll spends 16 hours on reddit a day he deserves some kind of sympathy for feeling disconnected and hating everyone? It sounds like in your comment that Jordan Peterson is explaining it like we're supposed to accept that it's so hard to leave mother's basement, I don't follow.

Kaiyou 7y ago
So tell me how people that do not own cars, do not drink alcohol, have no interest in video game tournaments or rock concerts should fit in. Asking for a friend.
- krapp 7y ago
  > So tell me how people that do not own cars, do not drink alcohol, have no interest in video game tournaments or rock concerts should fit in. Asking for a friend. The four possibilities mentioned by skim_milk do not define the entire combinatorial space of possible human cultural and societal interaction. The world has billions of people in it who don't fit those criteria, yet somehow they manage to socialize. Your friend needs to not be so pedantic. Surely they have common interests with someone.
  - Mediterraneo10 7y ago
    It is not enough to have common interests. The internet has shown people what it is like to interact with others in a place where no one can see the real you. While it is limiting and lonely in some respects, it is also immensely freeing in others. That leaves many people wary of socializing in real life because, as anyone knows from school, people regularly make fun of each other and judge each other for their appearance etc. even if they are friends. Why open yourself up to that? To me, that is a huge barrier to restoring the kind of community institutions that existed in decades past. Also, when people talk about how men need to be able to meet IRL and have group social experiences (like the bowling leagues of old), they fail to account for how some men at those social events often show hypermasculine behaviors like making fart jokes, talking about banging hot women, complaining about “faggots”, etc. There are plenty of men who are uncomfortable with that. At least on the internet one can find common-interest forums that don’t have that kind of extraneous and uncomfortable humor or obsession with sex.
  - Kaiyou 7y ago
    What if common interests are shitposting on the Internet? Key questions from the original poster were.. > They literally just don’t care about society anymore. Why should they? Where’s the buy in? Going out and socializing doesn't strike me as a purpose in life. Especially when you dislike socializing in the first place.
    - krapp 7y ago
      >What if common interests are shitposting on the Internet? No one's only interest is shitposting on the internet. I can read your comment history and see you have an interest in anime, and being on HN implies you likely have some interest in programming of CS. >Going out and socializing doesn't strike me as a purpose in life. Especially when you dislike socializing in the first place. It's no more or less a purpose in life than staying in. But being asocial still isn't an excuse for being antisocial. You can go out in the real world and not be a toxic, hateful ass, just as you can online.
      - Kaiyou 7y ago
        Well sure, but the places where shitposters can hang around are the only places you don't eventually get banned from for expressing wrongthink opinions and they also have people that are interested in anime and programming. It's hard to get a sense of belonging to communities that just ban you. Maybe you just see a place with toxic, hateful asses, but I see a place where everything can be discussed and some random comments won't get you kicked out of communities you were a part of for decades. There's a true sense of belonging. Even if everyone on there hates you personally, at least no one is going to just ban you.
        krapp 7y ago
        I know how much you like Voat and the chans and how much you enjoy your freedom to engage in let's call it "wrongthink shenanigans." But you can't really "belong" there. You can't belong in a place where you have no identity. You're just words in a textbox attached to a nonentity no one knows or cares about. If all you want from a community is amoral irony and a lack of social consequence, then fine. Perhaps if you have no faith in people or society, you have no expectations of others beyond immediate emotional gratification, and the world is nothing but an endorphin pump to you. But "belonging" is a social process. To belong is to adapt, and meaningful interaction requires both sincerity and empathy. If you can't keep yourself from expressing... "wrongthink" opinions even when you know you're around people who won't tolerate them, then the problem isn't where you are, it's who you are. You aren't even trying to belong - you want to be tolerated but you're unwilling to tolerate.
- lelethrowaway 7y ago
  Well yeah if you have no hobbies you'll find fewer avenues for meeting people. Taking an interest in people and things they do is a basic requirement if you want to bond with them.
  - Kaiyou 7y ago
    You're kind of missing the point here. The original poster said: > They literally just don’t care about society anymore. Why should they? Where’s the buy in? That is the question. I've got no interest in bonding with people, actually. What I desire are intelligent entities to exchange ideas with. I'm an INTP, for what it's worth. Social situations are hard work for me.

Kaiyou 7y ago

So tell me how people that do not own cars, do not drink alcohol, have no interest in video game tournaments or rock concerts should fit in. Asking for a friend.

krapp 7y ago
> So tell me how people that do not own cars, do not drink alcohol, have no interest in video game tournaments or rock concerts should fit in. Asking for a friend. The four possibilities mentioned by skim_milk do not define the entire combinatorial space of possible human cultural and societal interaction. The world has billions of people in it who don't fit those criteria, yet somehow they manage to socialize. Your friend needs to not be so pedantic. Surely they have common interests with someone.
- Mediterraneo10 7y ago
  It is not enough to have common interests. The internet has shown people what it is like to interact with others in a place where no one can see the real you. While it is limiting and lonely in some respects, it is also immensely freeing in others. That leaves many people wary of socializing in real life because, as anyone knows from school, people regularly make fun of each other and judge each other for their appearance etc. even if they are friends. Why open yourself up to that? To me, that is a huge barrier to restoring the kind of community institutions that existed in decades past. Also, when people talk about how men need to be able to meet IRL and have group social experiences (like the bowling leagues of old), they fail to account for how some men at those social events often show hypermasculine behaviors like making fart jokes, talking about banging hot women, complaining about “faggots”, etc. There are plenty of men who are uncomfortable with that. At least on the internet one can find common-interest forums that don’t have that kind of extraneous and uncomfortable humor or obsession with sex.
- Kaiyou 7y ago
  What if common interests are shitposting on the Internet? Key questions from the original poster were.. > They literally just don’t care about society anymore. Why should they? Where’s the buy in? Going out and socializing doesn't strike me as a purpose in life. Especially when you dislike socializing in the first place.
  - krapp 7y ago
    >What if common interests are shitposting on the Internet? No one's only interest is shitposting on the internet. I can read your comment history and see you have an interest in anime, and being on HN implies you likely have some interest in programming of CS. >Going out and socializing doesn't strike me as a purpose in life. Especially when you dislike socializing in the first place. It's no more or less a purpose in life than staying in. But being asocial still isn't an excuse for being antisocial. You can go out in the real world and not be a toxic, hateful ass, just as you can online.
    - Kaiyou 7y ago
      Well sure, but the places where shitposters can hang around are the only places you don't eventually get banned from for expressing wrongthink opinions and they also have people that are interested in anime and programming. It's hard to get a sense of belonging to communities that just ban you. Maybe you just see a place with toxic, hateful asses, but I see a place where everything can be discussed and some random comments won't get you kicked out of communities you were a part of for decades. There's a true sense of belonging. Even if everyone on there hates you personally, at least no one is going to just ban you.
      - krapp 7y ago
        I know how much you like Voat and the chans and how much you enjoy your freedom to engage in let's call it "wrongthink shenanigans." But you can't really "belong" there. You can't belong in a place where you have no identity. You're just words in a textbox attached to a nonentity no one knows or cares about. If all you want from a community is amoral irony and a lack of social consequence, then fine. Perhaps if you have no faith in people or society, you have no expectations of others beyond immediate emotional gratification, and the world is nothing but an endorphin pump to you. But "belonging" is a social process. To belong is to adapt, and meaningful interaction requires both sincerity and empathy. If you can't keep yourself from expressing... "wrongthink" opinions even when you know you're around people who won't tolerate them, then the problem isn't where you are, it's who you are. You aren't even trying to belong - you want to be tolerated but you're unwilling to tolerate.
lelethrowaway 7y ago
Well yeah if you have no hobbies you'll find fewer avenues for meeting people. Taking an interest in people and things they do is a basic requirement if you want to bond with them.
- Kaiyou 7y ago
  You're kind of missing the point here. The original poster said: > They literally just don’t care about society anymore. Why should they? Where’s the buy in? That is the question. I've got no interest in bonding with people, actually. What I desire are intelligent entities to exchange ideas with. I'm an INTP, for what it's worth. Social situations are hard work for me.