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How long can Amazon maintain the charade? If you look at their Net Operating Profits, they are not doing so hot, and without AWS, they are a really big startup.

How long can Amazon maintain the charade? If you look at their Net Operating Profits, they are not doing so hot, and without AWS, they are a really big startup. The competition is catching up; especially Walmart, and Target is the gold standard in omnichannel retail now. How long can Amazon's cloud business subsidize their retail ambitions?

manigandham 7y ago
This comes up often. Amazon profits are "small" because they reinvest into growth. It's a trillion-dollar corporation operating in multiple sectors with massive free cash flow. They're doing just fine and AWS only adds to their margin. I suggest you read this for more details: https://www.vox.com/recode/2019/8/21/20826405/amazons-profits-revenue-free-cash-flow-explained-charts https://www.vox.com/recode/2019/8/21/20826405/amazons-profit...
- Sohcahtoa82 7y ago
  Yup. Amazon is only struggling if you combine being extremely short-sighted with taking an extremely shallow look at their finances.
- muddi900 7y ago
  I was referring to net operating profits based only on their ecommerce operations. Amazon has been selling the 'reinvest' argument for decades, but it would not be solvent without AWS. In fact your link kinda agrees: >All these investments have led to lines of businesses like AWS cloud computing and advertising that are relatively much more profitable than its e-commerce segment. I do not claim that Amazon has negative cash flow, and I do not know why you would assume I claimed that. The growth argument is going to get very weak eventually, because Amazon face resurgent competition at home, and regulatory hurdles & Alibaba abroad. Amazon is riding high on investor confidence, they have very little actually space for growth.
  - manigandham 7y ago
    Amazon is perfectly profitable. AWS being more profitable does not make the ecommerce unprofitable. Also profit is a financial formula derived from actual operating costs and margins. Free cash flow has nothing to do with positive or negative cash flow, it is the payment cycle of AR vs AP that gives them a very big buffer to work with. Also you can't claim that they have very little space for growth and then discount the very subsidiary that's growing fastest. Reinvestment isn't some made up argument, the company has been taking gross profits and reinvesting into expansion for decades. It's what they do best and it's crystal clear in the financial performance. Claiming that Amazon is insolvent (do you know what that means?) except for a single subsidiary is ridiculous and seems to indicate a failure in understanding the business or accounting.

manigandham 7y ago

This comes up often. Amazon profits are "small" because they reinvest into growth. It's a trillion-dollar corporation operating in multiple sectors with massive free cash flow. They're doing just fine and AWS only adds to their margin. I suggest you read this for more details: https://www.vox.com/recode/2019/8/21/20826405/amazons-profits-revenue-free-cash-flow-explained-charts https://www.vox.com/recode/2019/8/21/20826405/amazons-profit...

Sohcahtoa82 7y ago
Yup. Amazon is only struggling if you combine being extremely short-sighted with taking an extremely shallow look at their finances.
muddi900 7y ago
I was referring to net operating profits based only on their ecommerce operations. Amazon has been selling the 'reinvest' argument for decades, but it would not be solvent without AWS. In fact your link kinda agrees: >All these investments have led to lines of businesses like AWS cloud computing and advertising that are relatively much more profitable than its e-commerce segment. I do not claim that Amazon has negative cash flow, and I do not know why you would assume I claimed that. The growth argument is going to get very weak eventually, because Amazon face resurgent competition at home, and regulatory hurdles & Alibaba abroad. Amazon is riding high on investor confidence, they have very little actually space for growth.
- manigandham 7y ago
  Amazon is perfectly profitable. AWS being more profitable does not make the ecommerce unprofitable. Also profit is a financial formula derived from actual operating costs and margins. Free cash flow has nothing to do with positive or negative cash flow, it is the payment cycle of AR vs AP that gives them a very big buffer to work with. Also you can't claim that they have very little space for growth and then discount the very subsidiary that's growing fastest. Reinvestment isn't some made up argument, the company has been taking gross profits and reinvesting into expansion for decades. It's what they do best and it's crystal clear in the financial performance. Claiming that Amazon is insolvent (do you know what that means?) except for a single subsidiary is ridiculous and seems to indicate a failure in understanding the business or accounting.