5 ms·

A better REPUTATION system (??!!??!!) is the best you could come up with? I cannot think of a less important application of a national ID card. And even in thi

A better REPUTATION system (??!!??!!) is the best you could come up with? I cannot think of a less important application of a national ID card. And even in this area, Amazon/Newegg have solved the pretty nicely with the "verified purchaser" tag. How is the national ID card system better? For Serious Stuff (TM) like opening a stock trading account, laws have already been passed to make an all-electronic signup as binding as a paper signature. We criticize China when it does something like this, but when America does it's all fine.

ThomPete 16y ago
I think you are dismissing this on pretty unresolved ground. To claim that Amazon/Newegg solved it with "verified purchaser" is simply on unsubstantiated ground. I could find plenty of serious uses for reputation systems. In fact I would claim that reputation systems is going to be the future of verification.
- anonymous246 16y ago
  Please explain why such a "serious" use cannot be implemented with today's technologies. You can trivially ask people to give you their license number and run a lookup to confirm that they're who they claim to be at signup time. Yes, it's not gratis (see publicdata.com). But you stipulated that this is "serious" use, so that shouldn't be a problem.
  - ThomPete 16y ago
    Huh? I never said it couldn't be I said it wasn't. But again it's not simply a question about identification as in per the right username/password/license plate. I can log in and pretend to be anyone, in fact I can have multiple different accounts and be multiple different people. But when you add social proofing on top of it you have created a verification mechanism that is much stronger since it includes my very existence, my friends, what I do etc. Things that can't as easily be faked.
    - anonymous246 16y ago
      > But when you add social proofing on top of it you have created a verification mechanism that is much stronger since it includes my very existence, my friends, what I do etc. Things that can't as easily be faked. The point many of the critics here are making is that anonymity and privacy is required for a functioning democracy. Why does it matter WHO is saying something. Shouldn't the most important thing be WHAT is being said? Even in today's "everything goes" situation, libel/slander etc hasn't reached epidemic proportions to require policing everything people say. And even then, I would much rather have a central clearinghouse where aggreived parties can register to have their names etc not be displayed by web sites (think of it as a robots.txt for humans). Note that this can be implemented without an online ID and is different from the current proposal. I still haven't understood what is your problem with today's situation where people can create as many alter egos as they wish.
Alex3917 16y ago
"We criticize China when it does something like this, but when America does it's all fine." I'm not saying we should build this, just that in an ideal society it would make sense because there are real benefits.
- sbov 16y ago
  In an ideal society, where there is no fraud or stolen identities, what are the benefits in building this?
  - chopsueyar 16y ago
    It will end terrorism and drug abuse.
    - nitrogen 16y ago
      I'm guessing your comment was downvoted because people didn't appreciate the verbal irony (where both common meanings of appreciate apply). Or, if you were actually serious, then never mind.
      - chopsueyar 16y ago
        It was the former.

ThomPete 16y ago

I think you are dismissing this on pretty unresolved ground. To claim that Amazon/Newegg solved it with "verified purchaser" is simply on unsubstantiated ground. I could find plenty of serious uses for reputation systems. In fact I would claim that reputation systems is going to be the future of verification.

anonymous246 16y ago
Please explain why such a "serious" use cannot be implemented with today's technologies. You can trivially ask people to give you their license number and run a lookup to confirm that they're who they claim to be at signup time. Yes, it's not gratis (see publicdata.com). But you stipulated that this is "serious" use, so that shouldn't be a problem.
- ThomPete 16y ago
  Huh? I never said it couldn't be I said it wasn't. But again it's not simply a question about identification as in per the right username/password/license plate. I can log in and pretend to be anyone, in fact I can have multiple different accounts and be multiple different people. But when you add social proofing on top of it you have created a verification mechanism that is much stronger since it includes my very existence, my friends, what I do etc. Things that can't as easily be faked.
  - anonymous246 16y ago
    > But when you add social proofing on top of it you have created a verification mechanism that is much stronger since it includes my very existence, my friends, what I do etc. Things that can't as easily be faked. The point many of the critics here are making is that anonymity and privacy is required for a functioning democracy. Why does it matter WHO is saying something. Shouldn't the most important thing be WHAT is being said? Even in today's "everything goes" situation, libel/slander etc hasn't reached epidemic proportions to require policing everything people say. And even then, I would much rather have a central clearinghouse where aggreived parties can register to have their names etc not be displayed by web sites (think of it as a robots.txt for humans). Note that this can be implemented without an online ID and is different from the current proposal. I still haven't understood what is your problem with today's situation where people can create as many alter egos as they wish.

Alex3917 16y ago

"We criticize China when it does something like this, but when America does it's all fine." I'm not saying we should build this, just that in an ideal society it would make sense because there are real benefits.

sbov 16y ago
In an ideal society, where there is no fraud or stolen identities, what are the benefits in building this?
- chopsueyar 16y ago
  It will end terrorism and drug abuse.
  - nitrogen 16y ago
    I'm guessing your comment was downvoted because people didn't appreciate the verbal irony (where both common meanings of appreciate apply). Or, if you were actually serious, then never mind.
    - chopsueyar 16y ago
      It was the former.