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Normal people don’t study philosophy, and if they’re into computer science, they don’t care whether P!=NP — they just learn Java, Objective-C, Python or

by psawaya 16y ago

Normal people don’t study philosophy, and if they’re into computer science, they don’t care whether P!=NP — they just learn Java, Objective-C, Python or whatever else they find useful for becoming a successful software engineer. I resent that. Most programmers I've met find theoretical CS interesting, and learn things simply for the intellectual value of it. They just want to build things people use.

woodson 16y ago
From my anectotal experience, they might find it interesting, but would only rarely go in-depth and pursue it with the needed diligence to further the state of knowledge (cf. P!=NP).
jvdh 16y ago
That's exactly the difference the author means. Programmers like to know about this as a means to better achieve things or purely as a hobby, exercise for the mind. People who pursue a PhD go beyond that, and are simply interested in the absolute truths (in the Platonic sense).
- psawaya 16y ago
  But he said "they don't care", as if pursuing a career writing software usually means you aren't interested in those absolute truths. And I'm saying maybe you are, but you want your job to be about something else. Purely scientific questions like P!=NP are interesting to more than just academics. A Brief History of Time has sold over a million copies, and I bet mostly not to physicists.
dagw 16y ago
My experience is almost exactly the opposite. Most programmers care little to nothing about any sort of CS or theory. I've met successful programmers with years of experience who'd never even heard of even the simplest CS concepts like linked lists. How their language of choice actually works below the surface is a complete black box to them, and they're quite happy to keep it that way. If you meet a programmer who cares in any way about theory, then they are with all likelihood comfortably in the top 50th percentile and probably also in the top 25th.
- slantyyz 16y ago
  I think what you're saying can easily be extrapolated to any vocation... There are people who are passionate about what they do, and then there vastly more people who are doing it simply because it's a job.
  - dagw 16y ago
    Exactly. My point was that programming isn't too different than most other fields in this respect. This is easy to forget if the only other programmers you actually meet are top silicon valley hotshots.

by psawaya 16y ago

woodson 16y ago

From my anectotal experience, they might find it interesting, but would only rarely go in-depth and pursue it with the needed diligence to further the state of knowledge (cf. P!=NP).

jvdh 16y ago

That's exactly the difference the author means. Programmers like to know about this as a means to better achieve things or purely as a hobby, exercise for the mind. People who pursue a PhD go beyond that, and are simply interested in the absolute truths (in the Platonic sense).

psawaya 16y ago
But he said "they don't care", as if pursuing a career writing software usually means you aren't interested in those absolute truths. And I'm saying maybe you are, but you want your job to be about something else. Purely scientific questions like P!=NP are interesting to more than just academics. A Brief History of Time has sold over a million copies, and I bet mostly not to physicists.

dagw 16y ago

My experience is almost exactly the opposite. Most programmers care little to nothing about any sort of CS or theory. I've met successful programmers with years of experience who'd never even heard of even the simplest CS concepts like linked lists. How their language of choice actually works below the surface is a complete black box to them, and they're quite happy to keep it that way. If you meet a programmer who cares in any way about theory, then they are with all likelihood comfortably in the top 50th percentile and probably also in the top 25th.

slantyyz 16y ago
I think what you're saying can easily be extrapolated to any vocation... There are people who are passionate about what they do, and then there vastly more people who are doing it simply because it's a job.
- dagw 16y ago
  Exactly. My point was that programming isn't too different than most other fields in this respect. This is easy to forget if the only other programmers you actually meet are top silicon valley hotshots.