4 ms·

>The novel is symbolic about the dependence of the West on the oil, and the power struggles to control this valuable resource. Very first paragraph, and alread

>The novel is symbolic about the dependence of the West on the oil, and the power struggles to control this valuable resource. Very first paragraph, and already a turn-off.

ramblerman 7y ago
Did you read the book? It’s kind of hard not to at least consider the Arab and oil similarity to the fremen and spice on arrakis.
thih9 7y ago
Could you elaborate?
- huomri 7y ago
  Dune has often been interpreted as a story that contains metaphors to nodern politics such as how the spice dependence is similar to our oil dependence and undertones of how authoritarian regimes try to control the fates of peoples. A lot of the events in the books can be drawn as parallels to our history and modern day situations.
  - thih9 7y ago
    I was asking for more context on: > Very first paragraph, and already a turn-off. I know the context for the book’s first phrase, I wanted to know why earlier commenter considered the book’s first phrase a turn-off.
Lazare 7y ago
I mean, it's a novel about the politics of foreign powers trying to extract a valuable resource which is crucial for transportation from a desert region that is explicitly described as looking like a cross between Mexico and the Arabian Peninsula (even to the point of Arakis having date palms and saguaro cactus), so uh... ...what was a turn off? That the author felt the need to point out the glaringly obvious? (Obviously the book explored many other themes about power, religion, culture, environmentalism, etc., plus it was a pretty good story. But you can't really pretend the Middle East and oil weren't also major themes in the book.)
- Rebelgecko 7y ago
  I can't speak for what bugged the above poster, but that sentence is worded in an incredibly awkward way.
  - ulisesrmzroche 7y ago
    Not really. English your first language? I’d take out the last comma and that’s it
    - Lazare 7y ago
      Eh... The phrase "symbolic about" is weird. "X is symbolic" is fine, and "X symbolises Y" is fine, but "X is symbolic about Y" is unusual at best. I'd probably go for something like "The novel can be read as an allegory for the dependence of the West on oil, and for the power struggles which arise to control this valuable resource." I think that expresses the point in a clearer way, and is more idiomatic. But the author's version is clear enough, even if sounds to me like something a native speaker probably wouldn't come up with on their own.
    - Rebelgecko 7y ago
      Yup, I'm a monoglot. Saying something is "symbolic about" is awkward wording IMO. As is saying "dependence on the oil", instead of just "dependence on oil".
pedrow 7y ago
I hadn't really thought about that aspect before, but it is maybe not a coincidence that OPEC was founded in 1960 which would be around when Herbert was thinking about / researching Dune. I recently started re-reading it and IMO it still seems really fresh despite its age. A classic.
- Lazare 7y ago
  Yep. From Herbert: > The scarce water of Dune is an exact analog of oil scarcity. CHOAM is OPEC. (Source: https://web.archive.org/web/20080616111957/http://www.dunenovels.com/news/genesis.html https://web.archive.org/web/20080616111957/http://www.duneno...)
rsynnott 7y ago
That... fairly clearly is at least part of what Herbert was going for, though?

>The novel is symbolic about the dependence of the West on the oil, and the power struggles to control this valuable resource. Very first paragraph, and already a turn-off.

ramblerman 7y ago

Did you read the book? It’s kind of hard not to at least consider the Arab and oil similarity to the fremen and spice on arrakis.

thih9 7y ago

Could you elaborate?

huomri 7y ago
Dune has often been interpreted as a story that contains metaphors to nodern politics such as how the spice dependence is similar to our oil dependence and undertones of how authoritarian regimes try to control the fates of peoples. A lot of the events in the books can be drawn as parallels to our history and modern day situations.
- thih9 7y ago
  I was asking for more context on: > Very first paragraph, and already a turn-off. I know the context for the book’s first phrase, I wanted to know why earlier commenter considered the book’s first phrase a turn-off.

Lazare 7y ago

I mean, it's a novel about the politics of foreign powers trying to extract a valuable resource which is crucial for transportation from a desert region that is explicitly described as looking like a cross between Mexico and the Arabian Peninsula (even to the point of Arakis having date palms and saguaro cactus), so uh... ...what was a turn off? That the author felt the need to point out the glaringly obvious? (Obviously the book explored many other themes about power, religion, culture, environmentalism, etc., plus it was a pretty good story. But you can't really pretend the Middle East and oil weren't also major themes in the book.)

Rebelgecko 7y ago
I can't speak for what bugged the above poster, but that sentence is worded in an incredibly awkward way.
- ulisesrmzroche 7y ago
  Not really. English your first language? I’d take out the last comma and that’s it
  - Lazare 7y ago
    Eh... The phrase "symbolic about" is weird. "X is symbolic" is fine, and "X symbolises Y" is fine, but "X is symbolic about Y" is unusual at best. I'd probably go for something like "The novel can be read as an allegory for the dependence of the West on oil, and for the power struggles which arise to control this valuable resource." I think that expresses the point in a clearer way, and is more idiomatic. But the author's version is clear enough, even if sounds to me like something a native speaker probably wouldn't come up with on their own.
  - Rebelgecko 7y ago
    Yup, I'm a monoglot. Saying something is "symbolic about" is awkward wording IMO. As is saying "dependence on the oil", instead of just "dependence on oil".

pedrow 7y ago

I hadn't really thought about that aspect before, but it is maybe not a coincidence that OPEC was founded in 1960 which would be around when Herbert was thinking about / researching Dune. I recently started re-reading it and IMO it still seems really fresh despite its age. A classic.

Lazare 7y ago
Yep. From Herbert: > The scarce water of Dune is an exact analog of oil scarcity. CHOAM is OPEC. (Source: https://web.archive.org/web/20080616111957/http://www.dunenovels.com/news/genesis.html https://web.archive.org/web/20080616111957/http://www.duneno...)

rsynnott 7y ago

That... fairly clearly is at least part of what Herbert was going for, though?