4 ms·

Call me unambitious but I think I’d rather just write some code every day.

bt848 7y ago
Same. Just be who you are. The tech industry “growth expectations” culture is garbage. Just as a personal anecdote everyone told me constantly that I would never make Staff Engineer at Google (roughly the 90th percentile rank) by just contributing to the code base. But that is what I did, and I was promoted to that rank. And I got the satisfaction of not participating in all the anti patterns of “leadership “ where one person gets promoted for taking credit for the work of many other people, or for solving problems they also created, etc. In short I rather admire a trade like dentistry or carpentry where one just practices one’s skills to the best of their ability, and there is no such thing as “Senior Staff Dentist”.
codingdave 7y ago
There is nothing wrong with knowing what you like to do, and doing it. And having folk like you on a team is important - teams struggle whenever everyone is jockeying for a better position. So while "unambitious" can get a negative connotation, it deserves more respect - it gets the job done, and that is valuable.
- draw_down 7y ago
  Mmm, being the only non-striver on a team full of them also sounds like a bad time, a recipe for becoming under-valued. There is a condescension to this thing where people say “hey, that’s ok too” when it’s actually not ok for themselves. I can accept that, it is what it is, but it’s definitely there.
  - fizx 7y ago
    I have a non-striver on my team of strivers. He is quite valued, because he's: - always fun to be around (a consequence of not being overloaded) - the guy to say "the emperor has no clothes" (having time to look around does that) - always accurate with his estimates (because he really doesn't want to work overtime) - always high-quality with his output (because he's not rushed) Done right, working at 80% speed means that you have 20% of your time to pick up the super-high-value tasks that might otherwise fall by the wayside. Now, maybe he'll get promoted more slowly than his potential as a striver, but I don't actually think that's going to happen.
dbcurtis 7y ago
Yes, well, at some point you get tired of seeing people make the same mistakes over and over. Those people might be senior engineers tasked with architectural design for the first time. Those people might be management with their heads up their....um, with misguided ideas. So the Senior Staff position may involve less day-to-day coding/design, but a lot more heading off disaster, which I would argue adds huge value to the company, and personally I find satisfying. In fact, there is nothing less satisfying than failing to head off a disaster that you could see coming from miles away. I remember a very senior IC at one company I worked at, named Gary. Gary basically wandered from meeting-to-meeting, only attending a few minutes because his calendar was routinely triple-booked. He would listen to a few minutes of argumentation, ask the one question that would slice the problem open like a sharp machete to a coconut, and then move on to the next meeting. Didn't design much any more, but his contributions had huge leverage. Don't write off that some day you may want to be a Gary. It may come naturally at some point, when you frequently start thinking: "I've seen this movie before and it has a baaaad ending."
- novok 7y ago
  The hard part of being gary is being ignored even when you know it's a bad idea.
- draw_down 7y ago
  Yes, if “impact to the company” is an important metric to you, you should probably climb the ladder. I can’t identify with that, though. I just want to do my little piece and focus on the rest of my life. It’s ok if the company ends up doing something it shouldn’t have. That is just what happens. When I was younger, I spent a lot of energy fretting about such things; people didn’t listen to me. I learned to make peace with that, rather than vow to have my opinions heard. Besides, who is to say that I wouldn’t have just steered the ship into a different iceberg. I’m one of those crazy people who thinks unlimited vacation is a good idea and not a scam, done correctly of course. I suppose you’re right that I could magically change my mind one day. Hasn’t happened yet, 15 years in.
super-serial 7y ago
You can be ambitious and still hate everything to do with career tracks and personal development as seen by large corporations. I make sure I work somewhere that isn't too stressful, and pace myself as much as possible at the dayjob so I can work 20+ hours per week on my own business. I wish I could have a 3-day workweek so the other 4 days I could be coding my own projects. After $100k why do people even want more money? I just want more time to work on my projects for a chance to have my own business. I'll never understand why so many people choose to be put into golden handcuffs.
- scarface74 7y ago
  I’m nowhere near Silicon Valley or the west coast - I’m on the opposite side of the country in Atlanta. Yes I know people here live a good life, have a house, go on trips etc with a household income of less than six figures, but making more gives you a lot more “Ands” and less “ors”. You can have the nice house in the burbs, max out your 401K, enjoy decent date nights with your SO every pay period, save for vacations, pay other people to do stuff you don’t want to do (occasional meal prep, yard service, etc), and have enough left for the things that go bump in the night. Realistically, for all the “ands” it takes about $150K to $200K of household income. That’s without getting the biggest house, the nicest cars and the most expensive vacations. Also, I see “having my own business” and “having a less stressful life” as being the opposite of each other. I don’t have to worry about finding customers, budgets, marketing, and I have st least six weeks a year paid time off between vacation time and holidays. If the company disappears tomorrow I get another job.

Same. Just be who you are. The tech industry “growth expectations” culture is garbage. Just as a personal anecdote everyone told me constantly that I would never make Staff Engineer at Google (roughly the 90th percentile rank) by just contributing to the code base. But that is what I did, and I was promoted to that rank. And I got the satisfaction of not participating in all the anti patterns of “leadership “ where one person gets promoted for taking credit for the work of many other people, or for solving problems they also created, etc. In short I rather admire a trade like dentistry or carpentry where one just practices one’s skills to the best of their ability, and there is no such thing as “Senior Staff Dentist”.

codingdave 7y ago

There is nothing wrong with knowing what you like to do, and doing it. And having folk like you on a team is important - teams struggle whenever everyone is jockeying for a better position. So while "unambitious" can get a negative connotation, it deserves more respect - it gets the job done, and that is valuable.

draw_down 7y ago
Mmm, being the only non-striver on a team full of them also sounds like a bad time, a recipe for becoming under-valued. There is a condescension to this thing where people say “hey, that’s ok too” when it’s actually not ok for themselves. I can accept that, it is what it is, but it’s definitely there.
- fizx 7y ago
  I have a non-striver on my team of strivers. He is quite valued, because he's: - always fun to be around (a consequence of not being overloaded) - the guy to say "the emperor has no clothes" (having time to look around does that) - always accurate with his estimates (because he really doesn't want to work overtime) - always high-quality with his output (because he's not rushed) Done right, working at 80% speed means that you have 20% of your time to pick up the super-high-value tasks that might otherwise fall by the wayside. Now, maybe he'll get promoted more slowly than his potential as a striver, but I don't actually think that's going to happen.

dbcurtis 7y ago

Yes, well, at some point you get tired of seeing people make the same mistakes over and over. Those people might be senior engineers tasked with architectural design for the first time. Those people might be management with their heads up their....um, with misguided ideas. So the Senior Staff position may involve less day-to-day coding/design, but a lot more heading off disaster, which I would argue adds huge value to the company, and personally I find satisfying. In fact, there is nothing less satisfying than failing to head off a disaster that you could see coming from miles away. I remember a very senior IC at one company I worked at, named Gary. Gary basically wandered from meeting-to-meeting, only attending a few minutes because his calendar was routinely triple-booked. He would listen to a few minutes of argumentation, ask the one question that would slice the problem open like a sharp machete to a coconut, and then move on to the next meeting. Didn't design much any more, but his contributions had huge leverage. Don't write off that some day you may want to be a Gary. It may come naturally at some point, when you frequently start thinking: "I've seen this movie before and it has a baaaad ending."

novok 7y ago
The hard part of being gary is being ignored even when you know it's a bad idea.
draw_down 7y ago
Yes, if “impact to the company” is an important metric to you, you should probably climb the ladder. I can’t identify with that, though. I just want to do my little piece and focus on the rest of my life. It’s ok if the company ends up doing something it shouldn’t have. That is just what happens. When I was younger, I spent a lot of energy fretting about such things; people didn’t listen to me. I learned to make peace with that, rather than vow to have my opinions heard. Besides, who is to say that I wouldn’t have just steered the ship into a different iceberg. I’m one of those crazy people who thinks unlimited vacation is a good idea and not a scam, done correctly of course. I suppose you’re right that I could magically change my mind one day. Hasn’t happened yet, 15 years in.

super-serial 7y ago

You can be ambitious and still hate everything to do with career tracks and personal development as seen by large corporations. I make sure I work somewhere that isn't too stressful, and pace myself as much as possible at the dayjob so I can work 20+ hours per week on my own business. I wish I could have a 3-day workweek so the other 4 days I could be coding my own projects. After $100k why do people even want more money? I just want more time to work on my projects for a chance to have my own business. I'll never understand why so many people choose to be put into golden handcuffs.

scarface74 7y ago
I’m nowhere near Silicon Valley or the west coast - I’m on the opposite side of the country in Atlanta. Yes I know people here live a good life, have a house, go on trips etc with a household income of less than six figures, but making more gives you a lot more “Ands” and less “ors”. You can have the nice house in the burbs, max out your 401K, enjoy decent date nights with your SO every pay period, save for vacations, pay other people to do stuff you don’t want to do (occasional meal prep, yard service, etc), and have enough left for the things that go bump in the night. Realistically, for all the “ands” it takes about $150K to $200K of household income. That’s without getting the biggest house, the nicest cars and the most expensive vacations. Also, I see “having my own business” and “having a less stressful life” as being the opposite of each other. I don’t have to worry about finding customers, budgets, marketing, and I have st least six weeks a year paid time off between vacation time and holidays. If the company disappears tomorrow I get another job.