5 ms·

> What you are doing is showing excitement at the long history of forcing OUR values, systems, and in this case, living beings on another world. That is not our

by tomxor 7y ago

> What you are doing is showing excitement at the long history of forcing OUR values, systems, and in this case, living beings on another world. That is not our right, and it is not our job. If we carry on with that mentality, even if we took away the ‘colonization’ word the premise is the same. It’s colonialism. It’s imperialism. hmm, defending the rights of non existent beings from colonialism on a barren inhospitable moon? cmon it's a frickin postage stamp load of water bears... Let get real, if they manage to populate a single crater it will be a miracle, and no Moon creatures are likely to be harmed since they are so elusive. [edit] So, it seems this person has a bit of an anti planetary colonization, anti planetary contamination... anti planetary pretty much anything that comes in physical contact with it agenda: http://astrobiology.com/2019/07/absolute-prioritization-of-planetary-protection-safety-and-avoiding-imperialism-in-all-future-scienc.html http://astrobiology.com/2019/07/absolute-prioritization-of-p... Elon Musk is not going to like this person.

mirimir 7y ago
Let's say that we're talking about Earth, and the prospect of contamination by some invasive life form from wherever. Would you be OK with that? But even if we set aside morality, contaminating stuff makes it harder to know whether there was life there already.
- danjayh 7y ago
  It's different. Earth already has intelligent life. Mars and the moon do not.
  - airesearcher 7y ago
    The “astrobiologist” who claims sending tardigrades to the Moon is imperialism and colonialism is a counter-example to your claim that Earth already has intelligent life.
mc32 7y ago
If it were up to that person, we should all backmigrate to Africa and depopulate Eurasia, The Americans, Australia and Oceania because we’re not native to them and have colonized them over tens of millennia. Wonder if they themselves followed through with their own advice.
- lidHanteyk 7y ago
  Where did they say that?
  - slowmovintarget 7y ago
    Reductio ad absurdum
    - lidHanteyk 7y ago
      Ah, so you're shoving words into their mouth. Got it. Look, I understand the necessity and inevitability of going out to the stars just as much as any other cosmologically-minded person, but the author of that quote has serious points about contamination, following protocol, the looming danger of corporatization of space, respect for nature in its stark glory, and what kind of starfaring species we will choose to be. We ought to at least consider the possibility that we are headed in a poor direction, and consider a delta-v. Or we could just let corporations crash whatever they like into the Moon.
      - tomxor 7y ago
        > the author of that quote has serious points about contamination, following protocol, the looming danger of corporatization of space, respect for nature in its stark glory. No they don't, they have an ulterior SJW motive founded in science fiction - if anything they are doing a disservice by making decontaminating spacecraft into a joke. NASA cared about decontaminating spacecraft long before this person arrived, this has historically been driven by the concern of invalidating any discovery of life. The secondary concern is of disturbing an ecosystem in the extremely unlikely case that it exists at the destination AND is active AND the life being carried from Earth survives the journey and re-entry AND it miraculously manages to thrive in such an incredibly different (and commonly extremely harsh environment devoid of nutrients and atmosphere) AND competes better than the native organisms - note how both of these are scientific concerns, and the later (to which this person attached their insane argument) has an extremely small chance of happening. She is literally talking about colonialism and imperialism in space, as if these are real concerns and we might just charter a boat over there and rape the natives. If our little experiments are to fit the definition colonialism, then so is the evolution of different ecologies as new species migrate and invade others over time.
sq_ 7y ago
Not trying to be combative, but I find it interesting that you specifically note that you think "Elon Musk is not going to like this person". Is there a specific reason that you feel like that and wanted to note it? I know he's usually known for being rather outspoken about his chosen method in a given field of space exploration.
- tomxor 7y ago
  > I find it interesting that you specifically note that you think "Elon Musk is not going to like this person". Is there a specific reason that you feel like that and wanted to note it? He wants to colonize Mars, he has stated this desire in great detail publicly on multiple occasions.
- CamperBob2 7y ago
  Being so fanatical about "contaminating" the Moon with tardigrades doesn't bode well for the person's opinion of "contaminating" Mars with human presence.

by tomxor 7y ago

mirimir 7y ago

Let's say that we're talking about Earth, and the prospect of contamination by some invasive life form from wherever. Would you be OK with that? But even if we set aside morality, contaminating stuff makes it harder to know whether there was life there already.

danjayh 7y ago
It's different. Earth already has intelligent life. Mars and the moon do not.
- airesearcher 7y ago
  The “astrobiologist” who claims sending tardigrades to the Moon is imperialism and colonialism is a counter-example to your claim that Earth already has intelligent life.

mc32 7y ago

If it were up to that person, we should all backmigrate to Africa and depopulate Eurasia, The Americans, Australia and Oceania because we’re not native to them and have colonized them over tens of millennia. Wonder if they themselves followed through with their own advice.

lidHanteyk 7y ago
Where did they say that?
- slowmovintarget 7y ago
  Reductio ad absurdum
  - lidHanteyk 7y ago
    Ah, so you're shoving words into their mouth. Got it. Look, I understand the necessity and inevitability of going out to the stars just as much as any other cosmologically-minded person, but the author of that quote has serious points about contamination, following protocol, the looming danger of corporatization of space, respect for nature in its stark glory, and what kind of starfaring species we will choose to be. We ought to at least consider the possibility that we are headed in a poor direction, and consider a delta-v. Or we could just let corporations crash whatever they like into the Moon.
    - tomxor 7y ago
      > the author of that quote has serious points about contamination, following protocol, the looming danger of corporatization of space, respect for nature in its stark glory. No they don't, they have an ulterior SJW motive founded in science fiction - if anything they are doing a disservice by making decontaminating spacecraft into a joke. NASA cared about decontaminating spacecraft long before this person arrived, this has historically been driven by the concern of invalidating any discovery of life. The secondary concern is of disturbing an ecosystem in the extremely unlikely case that it exists at the destination AND is active AND the life being carried from Earth survives the journey and re-entry AND it miraculously manages to thrive in such an incredibly different (and commonly extremely harsh environment devoid of nutrients and atmosphere) AND competes better than the native organisms - note how both of these are scientific concerns, and the later (to which this person attached their insane argument) has an extremely small chance of happening. She is literally talking about colonialism and imperialism in space, as if these are real concerns and we might just charter a boat over there and rape the natives. If our little experiments are to fit the definition colonialism, then so is the evolution of different ecologies as new species migrate and invade others over time.

sq_ 7y ago

Not trying to be combative, but I find it interesting that you specifically note that you think "Elon Musk is not going to like this person". Is there a specific reason that you feel like that and wanted to note it? I know he's usually known for being rather outspoken about his chosen method in a given field of space exploration.

tomxor 7y ago
> I find it interesting that you specifically note that you think "Elon Musk is not going to like this person". Is there a specific reason that you feel like that and wanted to note it? He wants to colonize Mars, he has stated this desire in great detail publicly on multiple occasions.
CamperBob2 7y ago
Being so fanatical about "contaminating" the Moon with tardigrades doesn't bode well for the person's opinion of "contaminating" Mars with human presence.