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It is not “practically impossible” for individuals to set up their own email servers with good deliverability. I run my own and emails get delivered to my inten

It is not “practically impossible” for individuals to set up their own email servers with good deliverability. I run my own and emails get delivered to my intended receivers all the time. If you want email to become more distributed someone ought to come along to make a Helm that isn't so expensive. You just have to make the protocol sticky enough and distributed enough so one corp doesn't wield Total Control.

randallsquared 7y ago
> I run my own and emails get delivered to my intended receivers all the time. That's a pretty low bar, unless you mean "all the time" as "every single time". :) Before I gave up and moved to AWS Workmail this year, I'd run a personal mail server for about 20 years. Major issues were not too uncommon, and minor ones were constant: "Why can everyone in the world get mail from my server except outlook.com users?" I can't remember if I ever resolved this. "Why do more and more corporate servers ignore SMTP retry rules?" It was nice when only spammers did that and graylisting was effective. "No, it's not my server that's sending those spam emails that spoof my domain; I checked. Yes, really." This happened more than a decade ago, and I assume it either stopped or was solved by the spread of TLS or something.
- emptysongglass 7y ago
  I have had a Gmail account since the beginning and have, not infrequently, had my sent email arrive in spam. These arguments against the ease with which we may decentralize basic ubiquitious protocols lean on, I don't know, a basic bleak outlook? People thought I was crazy for unplugging from every Facebook service. No one would follow me over to my messenger of choice they said. I proved them wrong. And you can too. But it takes a little patience and a little persistence and little sticking to your ideals. Our basic internet freedoms are worth this.
notyourday 7y ago
You are a fluke of a customer. My bodega owner is a customer. So are his kids that help him. And an old mexican lady who works in a hipster coffee shop because hipsters that own it cannot be bothered to get up at 6am to open at 7am. They use email. None of them are interested in "setting up their own email server". They are interested in being able to send email and get email.
- emptysongglass 7y ago
  Please read my comment fully. Helm is one such solution that gets out of your way but is too expensive. The price on these do it for you boxes needs to come down. It doesn't take much capability beyond email for one of these boxes to convince an everyday user.
  - notyourday 7y ago
    > Helm is one such solution that gets out of your way but is too expensive. My bodega owner lost interest the moment you said "solution that gets out of your way". He simply does not care to hear about it. He wants to click on an envelop icon and see his email. He wants to type his message, hit send and know that his message is delivered. Until the OSS, Protocols not Platforms, "Use firefox and not chrome because its technology is better" advocates internalize that not a single argument other than "does it just work?" matters to users, SaaS, Platforms and Chrome will continue to clean the clock of OSS, Protocols and Firefox.
UncleMeat 7y ago
I would wager than fewer than 1/100,000 adults on the planet can succeed at setting up and maintaining their own email server with good deliverability. That's "practically impossible".

randallsquared 7y ago

> I run my own and emails get delivered to my intended receivers all the time. That's a pretty low bar, unless you mean "all the time" as "every single time". :) Before I gave up and moved to AWS Workmail this year, I'd run a personal mail server for about 20 years. Major issues were not too uncommon, and minor ones were constant: "Why can everyone in the world get mail from my server except outlook.com users?" I can't remember if I ever resolved this. "Why do more and more corporate servers ignore SMTP retry rules?" It was nice when only spammers did that and graylisting was effective. "No, it's not my server that's sending those spam emails that spoof my domain; I checked. Yes, really." This happened more than a decade ago, and I assume it either stopped or was solved by the spread of TLS or something.

emptysongglass 7y ago
I have had a Gmail account since the beginning and have, not infrequently, had my sent email arrive in spam. These arguments against the ease with which we may decentralize basic ubiquitious protocols lean on, I don't know, a basic bleak outlook? People thought I was crazy for unplugging from every Facebook service. No one would follow me over to my messenger of choice they said. I proved them wrong. And you can too. But it takes a little patience and a little persistence and little sticking to your ideals. Our basic internet freedoms are worth this.

notyourday 7y ago

You are a fluke of a customer. My bodega owner is a customer. So are his kids that help him. And an old mexican lady who works in a hipster coffee shop because hipsters that own it cannot be bothered to get up at 6am to open at 7am. They use email. None of them are interested in "setting up their own email server". They are interested in being able to send email and get email.

emptysongglass 7y ago
Please read my comment fully. Helm is one such solution that gets out of your way but is too expensive. The price on these do it for you boxes needs to come down. It doesn't take much capability beyond email for one of these boxes to convince an everyday user.
- notyourday 7y ago
  > Helm is one such solution that gets out of your way but is too expensive. My bodega owner lost interest the moment you said "solution that gets out of your way". He simply does not care to hear about it. He wants to click on an envelop icon and see his email. He wants to type his message, hit send and know that his message is delivered. Until the OSS, Protocols not Platforms, "Use firefox and not chrome because its technology is better" advocates internalize that not a single argument other than "does it just work?" matters to users, SaaS, Platforms and Chrome will continue to clean the clock of OSS, Protocols and Firefox.

UncleMeat 7y ago

I would wager than fewer than 1/100,000 adults on the planet can succeed at setting up and maintaining their own email server with good deliverability. That's "practically impossible".