12 ms·

I don't think Carmack is the problem here.

by bananocurrency 7y ago

emsy 7y ago
What's the problem with Joe Rogan?
- kibibu 7y ago
  A common complaint with Joe Rogan is that he gives a platform and an audience to assholes like Gavin McInnes and Alex Jones.
  - gigatexal 7y ago
    Giving Alex Jones a platform is one thing but a bigger problem is people that believe the nonsense he speaks. When did society become the collective brain for everyone? It’s on the individual to figure stuff out for him or herself. Joe is a heavily left leaning (socially) capitalist, he seems to me to be very libertarian. I bet there’s a number of Silicon Valley engineers who lean the same way except maybe for his stance on guns. He has everyone on his show. “Crazy” people to the mainstream. And in any case it’s his show you’re free to not give it patronage.
    - h0h0h0h0111 7y ago
      In fairness though, a lot of Alex Jones's detractors probably have never _actually_ watched him though, aside from selected clips from their media outlet of choice (likely bashing him); so I think having him on something somewhat mainstream like Joe Rogan's podcast gives the average person a chance to listen to him and decide for themselves that he's batshit crazy without having it spoonfed to them by another source.
  - skrebbel 7y ago
    This is a correct observation, stated drily without any opinion mixed in. I don't understand why people downvoted you. EDIT: I read over the word "assholes". Not drily at all.
  - dhyft 7y ago
    People I don't like are talking :'( :'(
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]
  - LandR 7y ago
    Do people not realise how dangerous a viewpoint this is, to stop people you don't agree with talking / deplatforming. How do the left not realise how authoritiarian they actually are in this regard? And making someone out to be a right wing nazi because of who they spoke to on their show is madness. I'm not even sure it's honest on the part of these people, I think they know Joe Rogan isnt some right wing nazi but they say it just to fit in with their "group".
  - lagadu 7y ago
    How is it a bad thing that he promotes the free exchange and presentation of ideas?
    - TheBranca18 7y ago
      It's a bad thing to promote people such as McInnes, who if they had control of the world would prevent such free exchange and presentation of ideas and would kill minorities. It's his show so obviously he's free to do what he wants, but I think one of the most popular podcasts in the world should show restraint when presenting people who are neo-fascists. This normalization isn't helpful and I feel strongly that people such as McInnes should be deplatformed, and he has on places such as Twitter, as studies have shown it to be the best way to stop the propagation of such harmful ideas.
      - anon12345690 7y ago
        sounds like you dont know who gavin is then why dont you watch the episode with him and learn for yourself thats why its not good to deplatform people you dont like because other people told you not to like them
        TheBranca18 7y ago
        It's increasingly clear that I have less in common with many on Hacker News when these types of responses are considered valuable. > sounds like you dont know who gavin is then This is directly from Wikipedia. > McInnes was a leading figure in the hipster subculture while at Vice, being labelled as the "godfather" of hipsterdom. After leaving the company in 2008, he became increasingly known for his far-right political views. He is the founder of the Proud Boys, a neo-fascist men's group classified as a "general hate" organization by the Southern Poverty Law Center. I called him a neo-fascist, I'd love to know what makes you conclude I don't know who he is. > why dont you watch the episode with him and learn for yourself That's not learning for myself, learning for myself is consulting various sources and investigating things he said and actions he's done. Not hearing a milquetoast description of his views from the man himself that aren't being challenged. > thats why its not good to deplatform people you dont like because other people told you not to like them Why would you jump to this? What in my response told you that someone else told me not to like him? McInnes screaming the n word the way he has in the past among many of his other actions makes me not like him. Edit: I'm also clueless as to how my response was directly to the main thread as there was a deeper thread I was trying to respond to originally. Not sure what went on there.
  - dlivingston 7y ago
    The best rebuttal to the idea of 'deplatforming' is from John Stuart Mills, in On Liberty: > “He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them. But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion... Nor is it enough that he should hear the opinions of adversaries from his own teachers, presented as they state them, and accompanied by what they offer as refutations. He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them...he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.”
- SquareWheel 7y ago
  I don't know about his recent activity, but he does have a history of pushing conspiracy theories. Most notably he claimed the moon landing was a hoax. That alone has put me off watching his show (as much as I enjoy hearing Carmack speak).
  - nailer 7y ago
    > I don't know about his recent activity, but he does has a history of pushing conspiracy theories. Most notably he claimed the moon landing was a hoax. I subscribe to JRE and this watch it regularly. Rogan has not recently pushed the moon landing was a hoax. I'm not sure where you got that information. Rogan has discussed how he used to think the moon landing was a hoax many years ago and now thinks the moon landing happened. Rogan also talks about how most conspiracy theorists are sad, lonely people.
    - SquareWheel 7y ago
      >Rogan has not recently pushed the moon landing was a hoax. I'm not sure where you got that information. You're changing what I said. I said that he previously pushed the view. It's also not hard to find evidence of that. Here's the first result of a Google search where he claims NASA's footage was faked. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_KT7YlVuKI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_KT7YlVuKI e: Here's a video debating the topic with Phil Plait. https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLA3ED2E5D5A8D72CD https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLA3ED2E5D5A8D72CD
      - nailer 7y ago
        > You're changing what I said. Your comment "Most notably he claimed the moon landing was a hoax." is vague about whether Rogan recently has stated the moon landing is a hoax. I've added your full quote in my reply to let people judge for themselves. Further: > pushed the moon landing was a hoax. is not the same as: > It's also not hard to find evidence of that... he claims NASA's footage was faked He does believe some of the footage was faked - there are indeed inconsistencies there that aren't very well explained. That's not the same thing as believing the moon landing didn't occur, which was Joe back in Fear Factor / NewsRadio era. He's 52 now.
PavlovsCat 7y ago
Useres flagging stories so others don't see them, rather than using the "hide" feature so they don't see them, is the problem.

I don't think Carmack is the problem here.

emsy 7y ago

What's the problem with Joe Rogan?

kibibu 7y ago
A common complaint with Joe Rogan is that he gives a platform and an audience to assholes like Gavin McInnes and Alex Jones.
- gigatexal 7y ago
  Giving Alex Jones a platform is one thing but a bigger problem is people that believe the nonsense he speaks. When did society become the collective brain for everyone? It’s on the individual to figure stuff out for him or herself. Joe is a heavily left leaning (socially) capitalist, he seems to me to be very libertarian. I bet there’s a number of Silicon Valley engineers who lean the same way except maybe for his stance on guns. He has everyone on his show. “Crazy” people to the mainstream. And in any case it’s his show you’re free to not give it patronage.
  - h0h0h0h0111 7y ago
    In fairness though, a lot of Alex Jones's detractors probably have never _actually_ watched him though, aside from selected clips from their media outlet of choice (likely bashing him); so I think having him on something somewhat mainstream like Joe Rogan's podcast gives the average person a chance to listen to him and decide for themselves that he's batshit crazy without having it spoonfed to them by another source.
- skrebbel 7y ago
  This is a correct observation, stated drily without any opinion mixed in. I don't understand why people downvoted you. EDIT: I read over the word "assholes". Not drily at all.
- dhyft 7y ago
  People I don't like are talking :'( :'(
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
- LandR 7y ago
  Do people not realise how dangerous a viewpoint this is, to stop people you don't agree with talking / deplatforming. How do the left not realise how authoritiarian they actually are in this regard? And making someone out to be a right wing nazi because of who they spoke to on their show is madness. I'm not even sure it's honest on the part of these people, I think they know Joe Rogan isnt some right wing nazi but they say it just to fit in with their "group".
- lagadu 7y ago
  How is it a bad thing that he promotes the free exchange and presentation of ideas?
  - TheBranca18 7y ago
    It's a bad thing to promote people such as McInnes, who if they had control of the world would prevent such free exchange and presentation of ideas and would kill minorities. It's his show so obviously he's free to do what he wants, but I think one of the most popular podcasts in the world should show restraint when presenting people who are neo-fascists. This normalization isn't helpful and I feel strongly that people such as McInnes should be deplatformed, and he has on places such as Twitter, as studies have shown it to be the best way to stop the propagation of such harmful ideas.
    - anon12345690 7y ago
      sounds like you dont know who gavin is then why dont you watch the episode with him and learn for yourself thats why its not good to deplatform people you dont like because other people told you not to like them
      - TheBranca18 7y ago
        It's increasingly clear that I have less in common with many on Hacker News when these types of responses are considered valuable. > sounds like you dont know who gavin is then This is directly from Wikipedia. > McInnes was a leading figure in the hipster subculture while at Vice, being labelled as the "godfather" of hipsterdom. After leaving the company in 2008, he became increasingly known for his far-right political views. He is the founder of the Proud Boys, a neo-fascist men's group classified as a "general hate" organization by the Southern Poverty Law Center. I called him a neo-fascist, I'd love to know what makes you conclude I don't know who he is. > why dont you watch the episode with him and learn for yourself That's not learning for myself, learning for myself is consulting various sources and investigating things he said and actions he's done. Not hearing a milquetoast description of his views from the man himself that aren't being challenged. > thats why its not good to deplatform people you dont like because other people told you not to like them Why would you jump to this? What in my response told you that someone else told me not to like him? McInnes screaming the n word the way he has in the past among many of his other actions makes me not like him. Edit: I'm also clueless as to how my response was directly to the main thread as there was a deeper thread I was trying to respond to originally. Not sure what went on there.
- dlivingston 7y ago
  The best rebuttal to the idea of 'deplatforming' is from John Stuart Mills, in On Liberty: > “He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them. But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion... Nor is it enough that he should hear the opinions of adversaries from his own teachers, presented as they state them, and accompanied by what they offer as refutations. He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them...he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.”
SquareWheel 7y ago
I don't know about his recent activity, but he does have a history of pushing conspiracy theories. Most notably he claimed the moon landing was a hoax. That alone has put me off watching his show (as much as I enjoy hearing Carmack speak).
- nailer 7y ago
  > I don't know about his recent activity, but he does has a history of pushing conspiracy theories. Most notably he claimed the moon landing was a hoax. I subscribe to JRE and this watch it regularly. Rogan has not recently pushed the moon landing was a hoax. I'm not sure where you got that information. Rogan has discussed how he used to think the moon landing was a hoax many years ago and now thinks the moon landing happened. Rogan also talks about how most conspiracy theorists are sad, lonely people.
  - SquareWheel 7y ago
    >Rogan has not recently pushed the moon landing was a hoax. I'm not sure where you got that information. You're changing what I said. I said that he previously pushed the view. It's also not hard to find evidence of that. Here's the first result of a Google search where he claims NASA's footage was faked. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_KT7YlVuKI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_KT7YlVuKI e: Here's a video debating the topic with Phil Plait. https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLA3ED2E5D5A8D72CD https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLA3ED2E5D5A8D72CD
    - nailer 7y ago
      > You're changing what I said. Your comment "Most notably he claimed the moon landing was a hoax." is vague about whether Rogan recently has stated the moon landing is a hoax. I've added your full quote in my reply to let people judge for themselves. Further: > pushed the moon landing was a hoax. is not the same as: > It's also not hard to find evidence of that... he claims NASA's footage was faked He does believe some of the footage was faked - there are indeed inconsistencies there that aren't very well explained. That's not the same thing as believing the moon landing didn't occur, which was Joe back in Fear Factor / NewsRadio era. He's 52 now.

PavlovsCat 7y ago

Useres flagging stories so others don't see them, rather than using the "hide" feature so they don't see them, is the problem.