6 ms·

Without seeing the comments it's difficult to know if this is a reasonable call or not. I can certainly imagine posts from Facebook friends that I think would b

Without seeing the comments it's difficult to know if this is a reasonable call or not. I can certainly imagine posts from Facebook friends that I think would be disqualifying for a visa, but I can also imagine government employees overreacting. One imaginary scenario that occurs to me is the one where he is admitted, commits a terrorist act, and then everyone looks at his friends on Facebook who are posting the kind of content that would make you suspect terrorism, and we'd wonder - why is a person so obviously terrorist adjacent admitted to the country? On the other hand, my immediate thought on reading this is that I wouldn't let my phone, and definitely not my accounts, get searched on visiting a foreign country. I'd also support people encrypting their phones and turning them off prior to government checkpoints. I just don't know how to square my intuitions there with my doubts about this case. Finally, it strikes me as a bit elitist of the NYT to add "Harvard Student" to the title. If this choice is wrong, it's wrong regardless of which school he's been admitted to. If we can't judge people based on their friends, then we should apply that standard to the Harvard-bound and non Harvard-bound alike.

Moru 7y ago
Turn off your encrypted phone before border control works out like this: Detained the maximum time waiting for you to give up. If you don't give up, deported. Just don't bring your normal phone on trips. Get a burner phone with just Mum/Dad contacts and leave the real one home.
- martin8412 7y ago
  Or you know - Just not go to places that demand to look through your phone.
tastroder 7y ago
You go from "difficult to know if this is a reasonable call or not" to an imaginary scenario where you dream up the perfect scenario for some CBP agent to make it reasonable according to a pretty clear cut politicial narrative, not a factual one. Terrorists usually do not engage with the NYT to make headlines after being rejected entry to a country. These are people, please treat them like that. This mentality always reminds me of the mathematician that was delayed for working on their equations [0]. Stuff like this is grounded in weird and unrealistic terror fears and affects people. > I wouldn't let my phone, and definitely not my accounts, get searched on visiting a foreign country. So, you either don't travel or look caucasian enough for that to not be an issue for you personally so far? That's great but it's not like this is even a US-only thing, this is a quite common occurrence these days. > Finally, it strikes me as a bit elitist of the NYT to add "Harvard Student" to the title. With current administration actively villainizing citizens of other countries, reporting on the academic background of those affected seems perfectly reasonable. [0] https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/may/07/professor-flight-delay-terrorism-equation-american-airlines https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/may/07/professor-fl...
- maze-le 7y ago
  >> That's great but it's not like this is even a US-only thing, this is a quite common occurrence these days. I never heard of any of that except from the US and China.
  - jaynetics 7y ago
    North Korea does it, too.
  - madaxe_again 7y ago
    I’ve never had anything beyond a bag search going into China - zero interest in my phone or online accounts.
    - maze-le 7y ago
      I heard phone seizures were common when entering from the western continental route (Kazakhstan, Kyrgiztan).
      - madaxe_again 7y ago
        Not when I drove in that way about four years ago, it wasn’t, but it’s entirely possible it has changed in the interim.
  - tastroder 7y ago
    I guess that's more due to those two being in the media more often due to potential abuses. The UK, Canada, and Australia all have similar processes in place, with various degrees of restrictions. I'm sure there's others I'm not familiar with.
- sieabahlpark 7y ago
  Or... Delete your social media before you apply so there is nothing to follow? What do you want more, your 30 followers who you can get back or entry into the US?
inamberclad 7y ago
> On the other hand, my immediate thought on reading this is that I wouldn't let my phone, and definitely not my accounts, get searched on visiting a foreign country. You frequently don't have a choice.
mrunkel 7y ago
> Without seeing the comments it's difficult to know if this is a reasonable call or not. I can certainly imagine posts from Facebook friends that I think would be disqualifying for a visa, but I can also imagine government employees overreacting. He already received a visa. That was already approved. This was the CBP agent at the border. > On the other hand, my immediate thought on reading this is that I wouldn't let my phone, and definitely not my accounts, get searched on visiting a foreign country. I'd also support people encrypting their phones and turning them off prior to government checkpoints. I just don't know how to square my intuitions there with my doubts about this case. Then you will enjoy a prompt flight home. Do you really believe that the customs agent will say "oh darn, he said no. I guess I have to let him in then." > ...it strikes me as a bit elitist of the NYT to add "Harvard Student" to the title... This is called adding context. It shows how anyone can be affected by the capricious rules. A harvard student with an approved student visa was denied entry. This means he was vetted by the US State Department and Harvard University. This isn't just some tourist coming to see the sights. Should the NY Times have simply said "university student?" What would that have helped?

Moru 7y ago

Turn off your encrypted phone before border control works out like this: Detained the maximum time waiting for you to give up. If you don't give up, deported. Just don't bring your normal phone on trips. Get a burner phone with just Mum/Dad contacts and leave the real one home.

martin8412 7y ago
Or you know - Just not go to places that demand to look through your phone.

tastroder 7y ago

You go from "difficult to know if this is a reasonable call or not" to an imaginary scenario where you dream up the perfect scenario for some CBP agent to make it reasonable according to a pretty clear cut politicial narrative, not a factual one. Terrorists usually do not engage with the NYT to make headlines after being rejected entry to a country. These are people, please treat them like that. This mentality always reminds me of the mathematician that was delayed for working on their equations [0]. Stuff like this is grounded in weird and unrealistic terror fears and affects people. > I wouldn't let my phone, and definitely not my accounts, get searched on visiting a foreign country. So, you either don't travel or look caucasian enough for that to not be an issue for you personally so far? That's great but it's not like this is even a US-only thing, this is a quite common occurrence these days. > Finally, it strikes me as a bit elitist of the NYT to add "Harvard Student" to the title. With current administration actively villainizing citizens of other countries, reporting on the academic background of those affected seems perfectly reasonable. [0] https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/may/07/professor-flight-delay-terrorism-equation-american-airlines https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/may/07/professor-fl...

maze-le 7y ago
>> That's great but it's not like this is even a US-only thing, this is a quite common occurrence these days. I never heard of any of that except from the US and China.
- jaynetics 7y ago
  North Korea does it, too.
- madaxe_again 7y ago
  I’ve never had anything beyond a bag search going into China - zero interest in my phone or online accounts.
  - maze-le 7y ago
    I heard phone seizures were common when entering from the western continental route (Kazakhstan, Kyrgiztan).
    - madaxe_again 7y ago
      Not when I drove in that way about four years ago, it wasn’t, but it’s entirely possible it has changed in the interim.
- tastroder 7y ago
  I guess that's more due to those two being in the media more often due to potential abuses. The UK, Canada, and Australia all have similar processes in place, with various degrees of restrictions. I'm sure there's others I'm not familiar with.
sieabahlpark 7y ago
Or... Delete your social media before you apply so there is nothing to follow? What do you want more, your 30 followers who you can get back or entry into the US?

inamberclad 7y ago

> On the other hand, my immediate thought on reading this is that I wouldn't let my phone, and definitely not my accounts, get searched on visiting a foreign country. You frequently don't have a choice.

mrunkel 7y ago

> Without seeing the comments it's difficult to know if this is a reasonable call or not. I can certainly imagine posts from Facebook friends that I think would be disqualifying for a visa, but I can also imagine government employees overreacting. He already received a visa. That was already approved. This was the CBP agent at the border. > On the other hand, my immediate thought on reading this is that I wouldn't let my phone, and definitely not my accounts, get searched on visiting a foreign country. I'd also support people encrypting their phones and turning them off prior to government checkpoints. I just don't know how to square my intuitions there with my doubts about this case. Then you will enjoy a prompt flight home. Do you really believe that the customs agent will say "oh darn, he said no. I guess I have to let him in then." > ...it strikes me as a bit elitist of the NYT to add "Harvard Student" to the title... This is called adding context. It shows how anyone can be affected by the capricious rules. A harvard student with an approved student visa was denied entry. This means he was vetted by the US State Department and Harvard University. This isn't just some tourist coming to see the sights. Should the NY Times have simply said "university student?" What would that have helped?