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The cost of providing lights (even using LEDs) is still not economically cheaper than the sun in most cases. If hydroponics is done in open it would be interest
by troysk 7y ago
The cost of providing lights (even using LEDs) is still not economically cheaper than the sun in most cases. If hydroponics is done in open it would be interesting to see if there are actually any advantages given that hydroponic farms will be near city where land is more expensive than where the farmlands are. Also pests again become a problem. There is a reason that most hydroponic companies are targeting micro-greens and other leafy vegetables as they are easy to grow and also most of the produce is edible so less waste of area and electricity.
In my experiments, I built multiple automated hydroponic setups and I have been able to grow only micro-greens and lettuce successfully and in a shorter cycle. All other experiments of growing strawberries and saffron failed.
- unlikelymordant 7y agoI'd love to hear your thoughts on why they failed. I'm interested in trying to automate some hydroponic ginger/turmeric, which is a year long growing cycle. Have you written about your experiences at all?
- troysk 7y agoSaffron failed as it was my first try and had a completely unscientific approach. The fact that there are very few papers available didn't help. Strawberries failed as I was unable to regular the nutrient supply perfectly for the breed I had. They were too weak. By the time I figured out what nutrients were to be used, I had lost motivation. So I switched to easier experiments like grass and lettuce. I am not sure if rooted vegetables like ginger can even be cultivated successfully using hydroponics. That was my learning from saffron which has bulbs. What system do you plan to use NFT, DWC or drip? Some with ag background have done it; unfortunately, I know very less about plant biology. Haven't written much about it other than tweeting about it occasionally.
- stephenSinniah 7y agousing a medium like coconut coir would help especially if you want want to grow rhizomes or bulbs
- stephenSinniah 7y agoAlso farming is hard, I've killed a shit load of plants when I started out, you gotta learn from those mistakes, keep at it and eventually you'll enjoy the fruits of your labour. Also if you're looking into hydrophonic growing do look into the Kratky method(non circulating) This is a video by Dr Kratky https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pZZO1tYqcwk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pZZO1tYqcwk, I cannot recommend it enough, This is my go to method for growing herbs, tomatoes, eggplants and chili.
- troysk 7y agoThats a very intriguing approach. I might give it a try. Farming looks easy but I find it hard.
- tom_mellior 7y agoOne would hope that the "vertical" thing would take care of part of the land costs. Especially if you can stick your setup right on top of an existing building in a city.
- troysk 7y agoFarm land is much much cheaper, atleast in my country. Moving the farm to the top would mean you can have just one floor of plants. Cooling costs will go up (many hydroponic farms are rather going underground) and so will electricity which is higher in the cities. Countering, lighting costs can be lowered by using sunlight to complement. CO2 levels are higher in city, might help plants grow faster (and maybe thinner?). Transportation costs of produce will go down as they don't need to be transferred 100s of kilometres. We need a few experiments to figure out the logistics and economics of it as there are multiple factors.
- jplayer01 7y ago> Farm land is much much cheaper Farmland is only cheaper because externalities (financial, social, environmental) aren't reflected in the cost. Vertical farming is supposed to solve more problems than just "well, we have limited space in a city".
- GrumpyNl 7y agoCant you use sunlight and guide it through mirrors with rotating shelf's?
- gridlockd 7y agoYou can guide sunlight anywhere you want, it's still the same amount of energy for the footprint (disregarding losses). The "vertical" in "vertical farming" solves a non-problem, for the most part. We have more than enough farm land.
- Ma8ee 7y agoI don't think it is the lack of land in general that they are trying to solve. They are trying to solve that there's no land close to the consumers. Growing close to the consumers means fresher vegetables, less environmental impact from transports and making it possible to grow spieces that don't handle transport well.
- troysk 7y agoYou may but then you loose out on the advantage of accelerated growth because of artificial season cycles. LEDs are illuminated in such duration that the plant thinks flowering season has come even though it actually hasn't. A closed room is a VM for plants. Also, if you depend on sunlight, you can't grow all year around and can't charge premium for non-seasonal products making it uncompetitive against traditional agriculture.
- sylvinus 7y agoFYI https://en.agricool.co/ https://en.agricool.co/ are growing strawberries at scale in shipping containers but it took them a couple years of R&D.
- troysk 7y agoVery cool! Thanks for sharing.
- tom_mellior 7y agoWhere can you buy them? I remember seeing their container in Paris two years ago and checking out their website. At that time it said they were trying to figure out how to distribute them. That's what their FAQ still say. I see no indication that their product really exists, let alone "at scale".
- StanleyYelnats 7y agoYes, the electricity cost of cooling and lighting indoor farms is still too expensive. Another way of saying that they yield gains from farming indoors are not yet sufficient to offset the added costs. I am engineering varieties of tomatoes designed to be higher yielding indoors. P.S. you may also find this article informative. http://www.bbc.com/future/bespoke/follow-the-food/the-clean-farming-revolution/ http://www.bbc.com/future/bespoke/follow-the-food/the-clean-...