9 ms·

I agree with this article, but I think it can be summed up as, "People need the option to buy the LTSB release of Windows 10". Microsoft refuses to sell it to

I agree with this article, but I think it can be summed up as, "People need the option to buy the LTSB release of Windows 10". Microsoft refuses to sell it to consumers. It is an enterprise only option (unless that has recently changed and I am not aware of it). I have one windows 7 machine for playing WoW and it will stay on 7 until I can get the LTSB release of Windows 10 and the ability to turn off 100% of the telemetry, for real. If Blizzard would build an unsupported 64 bit ELF binary for WoW, then I would not even have windows. I'm not using wine.

bhhaskin 7y ago
You should check out Valve's Proton. It's wine, but not wine... It's another abstraction layer built on top and it is pretty amazing. For the most part it just works. Doing some quick searching it looks like people have WoW running on it.
- hawski 7y ago
  It is Wine, but with patches, that one day could be clean enough to go upstream. Some eventually are merged upstream.
- Nullabillity 7y ago
  WoW runs fine on regular Wine Staging, too (though DXVK in particular gives some rather ridiculous framerate improvements).
- ensignavenger 7y ago
  I keep hearing this, but I have so far not been able to get a single game (even ones marked with excellent support) to work on proton. I really, really, really want it to work, though!
bubblethink 7y ago
You can buy it for a couple of hundred bucks or thereabouts. You also need to buy some filler Microsoft stuff equivalent to paper clips to make up for the minimum requirement of 25 products. You will then be an Enterprise.
zsrxx 7y ago
Then pirate it. What do you care? This is like pirating a show they refuse to put on Netflix. They don't give you the option to conveniently buy what you want, so pirate it. Instructions on how to activate your installation of LTSC here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19420337 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19420337
- Nextgrid 7y ago
  Pirate KMS servers will go offline eventually right? Even if the legality isn’t a concern, the reliability and maintenance overhead is a problem. There are trust/malware concerns with client-side cracks as well.
  - zsrxx 7y ago
    That one hasn't gone offline in years, so I've never thought of this. Perhaps you are right, but I assume that it should be easy enough to find new ones if you need them. I wouldn't consider this approach to be "high maintenance".
  - vonapon 7y ago
    Throwaway account because I'm sensitive about admitting I do this kind of thing (perhaps moreso than I should be): In a word: no. KMSpico is kind of perfect. The process happens entirely locally, and is quite technically "clean".
  - anon9001 7y ago
    Here's a KMS server emulator, all open source: https://github.com/Wind4/vlmcsd https://github.com/Wind4/vlmcsd If you want to skip straight to the piracy, here's an open source package for you, complete with keys, hosted ironically on Microsoft servers, that uses vlmcsd: https://github.com/ekistece/vlmcsd-autokms https://github.com/ekistece/vlmcsd-autokms It's a pretty clever hack. It runs the KMS emulator locally and fakes the network connection with a TAP device from OpenVPN. Works perfectly.
    - michaelmrose 7y ago
miles 7y ago
Anyone can buy LTSC for a few hundred dollars. I cobbled together a post last year on acquiring it: https://tinyapps.org/blog/201811300700_windows_10_ltsc.html https://tinyapps.org/blog/201811300700_windows_10_ltsc.html However, it does require a willingness to enter into a VL agreement with Microsoft.
- steve19 7y ago
  Can I buy from someone who went to all the hassle already? Or are those organizations not allowed to distribute keys?
- herpderperator 7y ago
  I recently found out that people are selling legitimate keys on eBay for a few bucks: https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=windows+10+ltsc https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=windows+10+ltsc According to people who have purchased from there, they're VL keys that can be used many times (e.g. 2500 times), so they just sell the same key over and over to multiple people: > ...sellers on eBay are probably people that work for companies that get GVLK and MAK Product Keys from MSDN/Microsoft and then just sell 'em off because the companies they work for more than likely would never even notice? I mean, with MAK Product Keys having from 2500 to 5000 activations per key, at least if they still work the same way they did in Vista/7 days, most companies that pay for volume licensing never ever actually use anywhere near that many. [0] > after about 3 hours I got a mail with a key and a link to download "LTSCX64.2019.ENU.JAN2019.iso" from googledrive. I did not download the ISO, so I cannot comment on that, but I typed the key into VAMT and its description is "Win 10 RTM EnterpriseS Volume:MAK" and the key had 50 activations left. I tried it on one of my LTSC 2019 installations and it worked fine. I assume that the remaining activation count will decrease over time, even when I do not use the key on my other installations, as I suspect that the seller sells the same key to more than one buyer.. [0] > so, after about a week all 50 activations of the key I got are gone. since I only used 8 activations, one can be sure that the key was sold to multiple buyers. business as usual on ebay.. [0] It's probably against some contract somewhere, but IANAL. [0] https://forums.mydigitallife.net/threads/windows-10-enterprise-ltsc-2019-can-one-actually-buy-a-unique-key.79241/ https://forums.mydigitallife.net/threads/windows-10-enterpri...
fortran77 7y ago
I run Windows 10 "Pro" (not LTSB). It's fine. Really. The fact that there are a couple of bundled games is no big deal.
- alister 7y ago
  > It's fine. Really. I can tolerate some bloatware (like games), but what about the telemetry? Are you OK with that or did you find a way to disable all telemetry?
  - theclaw 7y ago
    Windows firewall will actually block the telemetry requests if you add all the telemetry hosts to it. Hosts file hacking doesn’t work because it bypasses that somehow.
    - AnonymousPlanet 7y ago
      Ugh, you know that the list of telemetry hosts is a moving target? How often do you update that list? How do you know your list is complete? How do you know that Windows firewall blocks all connections?
tonyedgecombe 7y ago
"People need the option to buy the LTSB release of Windows 10" That's just fixing the symptoms rather than the cause. The real solution is for Microsoft to treat its customers with a bit more respect.
- siempreb 7y ago
  > The real solution is for Microsoft to treat its customers with a bit more respect. This company (like most other companies) operates out of greed, and that doesn't go well with respect. They're just trying to milk as much as they can from you.
  - psv1 7y ago
    You can make a profit and treat your customers well.
    - Draiken 7y ago
      I'd argue that's only valid if you're a small company. Once you're a huge corporation with tons of stakeholders, it seems inevitable that you will compromise customers in favor of profits sooner or later.
      - psv1 7y ago
        I feel like this attitude lets big companies off the hook in a way. Yes, as the company grows it becomes more likely that they'll make these compromises, but that doesn't mean it's inevitable.
        TazeTSchnitzel 7y ago
        Shareholders will vote in someone who will compromise.
        Draiken 7y ago
        While I agree it seems like it lets them off the hook, that's not on them, it's on the society that shrugs that off as "normal". But if you follow the logical path from capitalism, it is most definitely inevitable. There is no way to maximize profits without hurting the users. If one company does the right thing, another will take it's place because it will generate more profit. Can you imagine a CEO constantly telling it's shareholders that they will not increase profits because they want to "treat customers more fairly"? He'd be sacked in the first opportunity.
cm2187 7y ago
You can do it half legally with an MSDN subscription. Big one off cost but if you regularly toy with windows VMs or re-installing OS on hardware it might be a good option. The license restricts you to testing only.
nicolapcweek94 7y ago
WoW works perfectly on linux with Proton, and installing it is as easy as getting Lutris and double clicking on WoW's icon. WoW classic also works perfectly, if that's your thing.

bhhaskin 7y ago

You should check out Valve's Proton. It's wine, but not wine... It's another abstraction layer built on top and it is pretty amazing. For the most part it just works. Doing some quick searching it looks like people have WoW running on it.

hawski 7y ago
It is Wine, but with patches, that one day could be clean enough to go upstream. Some eventually are merged upstream.
Nullabillity 7y ago
WoW runs fine on regular Wine Staging, too (though DXVK in particular gives some rather ridiculous framerate improvements).
ensignavenger 7y ago
I keep hearing this, but I have so far not been able to get a single game (even ones marked with excellent support) to work on proton. I really, really, really want it to work, though!

bubblethink 7y ago

You can buy it for a couple of hundred bucks or thereabouts. You also need to buy some filler Microsoft stuff equivalent to paper clips to make up for the minimum requirement of 25 products. You will then be an Enterprise.

zsrxx 7y ago

Then pirate it. What do you care? This is like pirating a show they refuse to put on Netflix. They don't give you the option to conveniently buy what you want, so pirate it. Instructions on how to activate your installation of LTSC here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19420337 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19420337

Nextgrid 7y ago
Pirate KMS servers will go offline eventually right? Even if the legality isn’t a concern, the reliability and maintenance overhead is a problem. There are trust/malware concerns with client-side cracks as well.
- zsrxx 7y ago
  That one hasn't gone offline in years, so I've never thought of this. Perhaps you are right, but I assume that it should be easy enough to find new ones if you need them. I wouldn't consider this approach to be "high maintenance".
- vonapon 7y ago
  Throwaway account because I'm sensitive about admitting I do this kind of thing (perhaps moreso than I should be): In a word: no. KMSpico is kind of perfect. The process happens entirely locally, and is quite technically "clean".
- anon9001 7y ago
  Here's a KMS server emulator, all open source: https://github.com/Wind4/vlmcsd https://github.com/Wind4/vlmcsd If you want to skip straight to the piracy, here's an open source package for you, complete with keys, hosted ironically on Microsoft servers, that uses vlmcsd: https://github.com/ekistece/vlmcsd-autokms https://github.com/ekistece/vlmcsd-autokms It's a pretty clever hack. It runs the KMS emulator locally and fakes the network connection with a TAP device from OpenVPN. Works perfectly.
  - michaelmrose 7y ago

miles 7y ago

Anyone can buy LTSC for a few hundred dollars. I cobbled together a post last year on acquiring it: https://tinyapps.org/blog/201811300700_windows_10_ltsc.html https://tinyapps.org/blog/201811300700_windows_10_ltsc.html However, it does require a willingness to enter into a VL agreement with Microsoft.

steve19 7y ago
Can I buy from someone who went to all the hassle already? Or are those organizations not allowed to distribute keys?
herpderperator 7y ago
I recently found out that people are selling legitimate keys on eBay for a few bucks: https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=windows+10+ltsc https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=windows+10+ltsc According to people who have purchased from there, they're VL keys that can be used many times (e.g. 2500 times), so they just sell the same key over and over to multiple people: > ...sellers on eBay are probably people that work for companies that get GVLK and MAK Product Keys from MSDN/Microsoft and then just sell 'em off because the companies they work for more than likely would never even notice? I mean, with MAK Product Keys having from 2500 to 5000 activations per key, at least if they still work the same way they did in Vista/7 days, most companies that pay for volume licensing never ever actually use anywhere near that many. [0] > after about 3 hours I got a mail with a key and a link to download "LTSCX64.2019.ENU.JAN2019.iso" from googledrive. I did not download the ISO, so I cannot comment on that, but I typed the key into VAMT and its description is "Win 10 RTM EnterpriseS Volume:MAK" and the key had 50 activations left. I tried it on one of my LTSC 2019 installations and it worked fine. I assume that the remaining activation count will decrease over time, even when I do not use the key on my other installations, as I suspect that the seller sells the same key to more than one buyer.. [0] > so, after about a week all 50 activations of the key I got are gone. since I only used 8 activations, one can be sure that the key was sold to multiple buyers. business as usual on ebay.. [0] It's probably against some contract somewhere, but IANAL. [0] https://forums.mydigitallife.net/threads/windows-10-enterprise-ltsc-2019-can-one-actually-buy-a-unique-key.79241/ https://forums.mydigitallife.net/threads/windows-10-enterpri...

fortran77 7y ago

I run Windows 10 "Pro" (not LTSB). It's fine. Really. The fact that there are a couple of bundled games is no big deal.

alister 7y ago
> It's fine. Really. I can tolerate some bloatware (like games), but what about the telemetry? Are you OK with that or did you find a way to disable all telemetry?
- theclaw 7y ago
  Windows firewall will actually block the telemetry requests if you add all the telemetry hosts to it. Hosts file hacking doesn’t work because it bypasses that somehow.
  - AnonymousPlanet 7y ago
    Ugh, you know that the list of telemetry hosts is a moving target? How often do you update that list? How do you know your list is complete? How do you know that Windows firewall blocks all connections?

tonyedgecombe 7y ago

"People need the option to buy the LTSB release of Windows 10" That's just fixing the symptoms rather than the cause. The real solution is for Microsoft to treat its customers with a bit more respect.

siempreb 7y ago
> The real solution is for Microsoft to treat its customers with a bit more respect. This company (like most other companies) operates out of greed, and that doesn't go well with respect. They're just trying to milk as much as they can from you.
- psv1 7y ago
  You can make a profit and treat your customers well.
  - Draiken 7y ago
    I'd argue that's only valid if you're a small company. Once you're a huge corporation with tons of stakeholders, it seems inevitable that you will compromise customers in favor of profits sooner or later.
    - psv1 7y ago
      I feel like this attitude lets big companies off the hook in a way. Yes, as the company grows it becomes more likely that they'll make these compromises, but that doesn't mean it's inevitable.
      - TazeTSchnitzel 7y ago
        Shareholders will vote in someone who will compromise.
      - Draiken 7y ago
        While I agree it seems like it lets them off the hook, that's not on them, it's on the society that shrugs that off as "normal". But if you follow the logical path from capitalism, it is most definitely inevitable. There is no way to maximize profits without hurting the users. If one company does the right thing, another will take it's place because it will generate more profit. Can you imagine a CEO constantly telling it's shareholders that they will not increase profits because they want to "treat customers more fairly"? He'd be sacked in the first opportunity.

cm2187 7y ago

You can do it half legally with an MSDN subscription. Big one off cost but if you regularly toy with windows VMs or re-installing OS on hardware it might be a good option. The license restricts you to testing only.

nicolapcweek94 7y ago

WoW works perfectly on linux with Proton, and installing it is as easy as getting Lutris and double clicking on WoW's icon. WoW classic also works perfectly, if that's your thing.