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There's just no way any elections in Russia would produce the results not approved by the government. Government controls the entire chain of custody, from ball

by m0zg 7y ago

There's just no way any elections in Russia would produce the results not approved by the government. Government controls the entire chain of custody, from ballot counting to final vote tallies, and has been routinely falsifying the results at all levels. It often doesn't even need to tell those in charge to do anything: they "know" who should win and they make sure it happens. They also know they will have significant issues, career, legal, and otherwise, if it doesn't happen. Funniest thing is, they don't even need to do this. Because nearly all of the mass media is under government control, the incumbents have overwhelming support of the people as it is.

toxik 7y ago
It's the "belt and suspenders" approach to vote manipulation.
- m0zg 7y ago
  This is also why it's absolutely terrifying that all the press in the US is controlled by like 5 people, and the rest of the information one gets is controlled by Google, Facebook and Twitter. Anyone who thinks this is not being used for nefarious purposes is incredibly naive. There are trillions of dollars at stake.
CENGaverK 7y ago
How do you know that, though? Are you a citizen of Russia? Because if you are not, I'm suspicious. I live in an undemocratic country but even then, we have a fairly good opposition and kind of a free media thanks to the journalists taking the risk of prison and social media so I was really surprised to find out there is no powerful opposition in my country, all of the media belongs to him and we citizens are just dumb people who wouldn't know our country better than outsiders. The thing is, a leader can't hold that much power. If he lost the election, s/he can play dirty, fight etc. but wouldn't be able to do as s/he pleases with the results. There is always a balance they need to be careful about and not everything is black and white.
- notfromhere 7y ago
  Voting irregularities are pretty standard in Russia, lots of international observers and reports have established it. Opposition candidates are regularly jailed, major protests and civil actions are suppressed, and if you really get under the Kremlin's skin, you find yourself assassinated or thrown out of a window. Putin's Russia is a very blatant authoritarian regime.
  - m0zg 7y ago
    Not just Putin's. There was only one time in my lifetime when nobody knew who would win the election. That was the 1996 election which was largely won by Yeltsin by hiring a bunch of consultants from the US to run it (and I also suspect that his campaign was at least in part financed by the US as well - his opponent was Gennady Zyuganov, a communist). Other than that I don't recall any even somewhat democratic elections at all. Needless to say, there weren't any real elections in the USSR either. Nor under Czar before that. It's a long, established tradition.
    - orbital-decay 7y ago
      >largely won by Yeltsin by hiring a bunch of consultants from the US to run it You sure it wasn't due to other candidates giving up their ambitions to stop Zyuganov?
      - m0zg 7y ago
        Pretty sure. In the first round Zuyganov and Yeltsin were neck and neck. Zuyganov looked _very_ viable to most of the older voting population who had quite enough of the "wild 90's" and wanted to go back to the socialist certainty of how things were before Perestroika, at least to some extent, and Zuyganov promised exactly that. Or at least how they remembered how things were: people tend to forget the bad things first, this is called the "good old days syndrome". Russian presidents don't usually try to dance awkwardly on stage unless things are truly desperate: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRysHHzLAmM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRysHHzLAmM :-) The entirety of Russia's entertainment industry was paid huge amounts of cash, mostly under the table, to stage concerts in support of Yeltsin. Where that cash came from nobody knows to this day.

by m0zg 7y ago

toxik 7y ago

It's the "belt and suspenders" approach to vote manipulation.

m0zg 7y ago
This is also why it's absolutely terrifying that all the press in the US is controlled by like 5 people, and the rest of the information one gets is controlled by Google, Facebook and Twitter. Anyone who thinks this is not being used for nefarious purposes is incredibly naive. There are trillions of dollars at stake.

CENGaverK 7y ago

How do you know that, though? Are you a citizen of Russia? Because if you are not, I'm suspicious. I live in an undemocratic country but even then, we have a fairly good opposition and kind of a free media thanks to the journalists taking the risk of prison and social media so I was really surprised to find out there is no powerful opposition in my country, all of the media belongs to him and we citizens are just dumb people who wouldn't know our country better than outsiders. The thing is, a leader can't hold that much power. If he lost the election, s/he can play dirty, fight etc. but wouldn't be able to do as s/he pleases with the results. There is always a balance they need to be careful about and not everything is black and white.

notfromhere 7y ago
Voting irregularities are pretty standard in Russia, lots of international observers and reports have established it. Opposition candidates are regularly jailed, major protests and civil actions are suppressed, and if you really get under the Kremlin's skin, you find yourself assassinated or thrown out of a window. Putin's Russia is a very blatant authoritarian regime.
- m0zg 7y ago
  Not just Putin's. There was only one time in my lifetime when nobody knew who would win the election. That was the 1996 election which was largely won by Yeltsin by hiring a bunch of consultants from the US to run it (and I also suspect that his campaign was at least in part financed by the US as well - his opponent was Gennady Zyuganov, a communist). Other than that I don't recall any even somewhat democratic elections at all. Needless to say, there weren't any real elections in the USSR either. Nor under Czar before that. It's a long, established tradition.
  - orbital-decay 7y ago
    >largely won by Yeltsin by hiring a bunch of consultants from the US to run it You sure it wasn't due to other candidates giving up their ambitions to stop Zyuganov?
    - m0zg 7y ago
      Pretty sure. In the first round Zuyganov and Yeltsin were neck and neck. Zuyganov looked _very_ viable to most of the older voting population who had quite enough of the "wild 90's" and wanted to go back to the socialist certainty of how things were before Perestroika, at least to some extent, and Zuyganov promised exactly that. Or at least how they remembered how things were: people tend to forget the bad things first, this is called the "good old days syndrome". Russian presidents don't usually try to dance awkwardly on stage unless things are truly desperate: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRysHHzLAmM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRysHHzLAmM :-) The entirety of Russia's entertainment industry was paid huge amounts of cash, mostly under the table, to stage concerts in support of Yeltsin. Where that cash came from nobody knows to this day.