8 ms·

Static blogs are ok until it's a smallish blog with not much content or many visitors. But can't recommend it for a serious blog proect. One would have to jump

Static blogs are ok until it's a smallish blog with not much content or many visitors. But can't recommend it for a serious blog proect. One would have to jump through the hoops and use hacks for even the basic things like commenting, searching etc. And forget about slightly advanced stuff like popular posts, related posts etc without some Hugo or Jekyll hacking. WordPress has the lowest barrier to entry as most shared hosts offer one click installs, is the most feature rich blogging platform and even for a complete noob, it is much easier to get started and even customize their blog to a great extent with plugins. I would also like to add that virus affecting WordPress is much of a myth now, WordPress has improved greatly in the recent years and if you just stick with the basic install and just install the reputable plugins, you should be fine. The hacking cases related to WordPress are very few and far between.

michaelanckaert 7y ago
I agree that getting things like comments and search running on a static site is a lot work. But I’m of the opinion your personal site doesn’t need those things. Rarely have I seen interesting discussion happen in the comments of a personal blog. All great discussion is held in aggregators like HN. Similarly search is best left to specialized platforms such as a search engine. Blogging software may have decent search by why recreate a search engine when duckduckgo.com will far exceed capabilities with site: and filetype:? For me a personal site and blog are mostly single visit kind of stops. I end up on a blog via a link but almost never do I feel the need to read the top 5 best posts of some blog. I got some interesting information from the current article but then I’m of to the next link that shows up in my feed. In my opinion a website needs readability[0] and an ATOM/RSS feed. All the rest is part ego ("my content is so great people just have to see what else I wrote") and part feature creep. [0] https://www.sinax.be/blog/general/guidelines-for-spartan-webdesign.html https://www.sinax.be/blog/general/guidelines-for-spartan-web...
- tehlike 7y ago
  Except if you are ayende.com/blog
- bishalb 7y ago
  Sure, for a personal site or a portfolio site, they are not even needed. I also use Hugo for one of my sites, which is just a 5 page website. It is great for such stuff. But for a personal blog, I think both of those things(commenting and search) are absolutely essential. >Rarely have I seen interesting discussion happen in the comments of a personal blog. I disagree with this and even more so if we are talking about programming blogs. A lot of interesting discussions and rebuttals happen in the comment sections. Regarding outsourcing search to a dedicated search engine, its a mixed bag. 99% of the users don't even know about the `site:` and `filetype:` stuff. You also have the option of embedding Google site search but the first four results are ads which isn't very ideal. Wordpress search is decent out of the box but if you want something advanced, it has some nice plugins that allow advanced searching with fuzzy matches.
  - majewsky 7y ago
    > But for a personal blog, I think both of those things(commenting and search) are absolutely essential. What I've found to work well for commenting is to put an e-mail address on the page where people can send their comments. When there is a good comment, I put an update in the article. The main advantage of this approach is that it weeds out garbage responses. By making it ever so slightly harder for people to post a comment, they are forced to take an extra few seconds to consider if they really have something meaningful to add.
    - bishalb 7y ago
      That is a good idea but would people really want to leave the site to open their email client and make a comment? I had once thought about a different approach - Creating a Google form (for each blog post) and then embedding it on the blog post. Then whenever anyone submits a comment via the form, it would get saved to a Google spreadsheet(this needs to be made publicly readable). The unwanted comments can just be deleted from the spreadsheet. The contents of this spreadsheet can then be obtained in a JSON format and displayed on the blog post using Javascript.
      - pier25 7y ago
pier25 7y ago
Those issues you mention can be easily solved with Jekyll or any other SSG. You do need a bit of hacking but the zero maintenance and raw speed of static sites is worth it IMO. I wouldn't go with Wordpress or any other CMS unless I absolutely needed permissions for multiple authors and such or if the author couldn't handle writing markdown and using a terminal command.
- bishalb 7y ago
  I am not sure how hacking Hugo or Jekyll could help me add commenting, searching etc. without using a third party service. Don't get me wrong, I still think they are great for small blogs and I use them myself as well for static sites but for a serious blog project or a money site, I think it is much more practical to go with a full blown solution like Wordpress. Regarding speed, with caching plugins and optionally with CDNs like cloudflare, Wordpress can be pretty fast. And for regular users who aren't tech savvy, hugo or jekyll are almost a no-go. >if the author couldn't handle writing markdown and using a terminal command. I would say this represents more than 99% of the bloggers. Even I prefer a WYSIWYG interface to markdown any day even though I consider myself somewhat tech-savvy. I find markdown to be very hacky when its a bit more than just headings and paragraphs(eg. nested lists with ordered list inside unordered list are so hard to do in markdown)
  - pier25 7y ago
    > I am not sure how hacking Hugo or Jekyll could help me add commenting, searching etc. Searching should be left to Google. I'm skeptical blog users actually search on a site though I admit I've never seen any metrics about that. If you insist on having comments on your site and force users to sign-in etc this can be easily implemented with an API and some client-side code. > I would say this represents more than 99% of the bloggers. This thread is about HN users, not the general population. > I find markdown to be very hacky when its a bit more than just headings and paragraphs(eg. nested lists with ordered list inside unordered list are so hard to do in markdown) Well, no wonder you prefer Wordpress.
    - bishalb 7y ago
viraptor 7y ago
> virus affecting WordPress is much of a myth now There's still few every year https://wordpress.org/news/category/security/ https://wordpress.org/news/category/security/ And that's just the core WordPress. Plugins and themes carry their own issues. Reputable or not.
chebum 7y ago
Yes, the website starts to build slower with growing number of pages. I'm using Metalsmith static site generator for https://www.visualwatermark.com/ https://www.visualwatermark.com/ The website currently have about 400 pages and it takes 60-70 seconds to build it. Part of the problem is Metalsmith itself - the code in some parts is awful. I had to make some changes to make it work faster. Unfortunately, it's impossible to solve the underlying problem - you have to build the whole website at once, while WordPress builds pages on-demand. Also static generators aren't as convenient as WordPress is. I'm OK working with markdown or hacking the code, but it's too difficult for my wife, for example. So, she's running a WordPress blog. Commenting is also better on WordPress. She used to use Discuss for commenting and people are more to reluctant leave Discuss comments than to leave WordPress comments. I believe that's because you don't have to register to leave a comment in WordPress - just type your email and you're ready to go.

michaelanckaert 7y ago

I agree that getting things like comments and search running on a static site is a lot work. But I’m of the opinion your personal site doesn’t need those things. Rarely have I seen interesting discussion happen in the comments of a personal blog. All great discussion is held in aggregators like HN. Similarly search is best left to specialized platforms such as a search engine. Blogging software may have decent search by why recreate a search engine when duckduckgo.com will far exceed capabilities with site: and filetype:? For me a personal site and blog are mostly single visit kind of stops. I end up on a blog via a link but almost never do I feel the need to read the top 5 best posts of some blog. I got some interesting information from the current article but then I’m of to the next link that shows up in my feed. In my opinion a website needs readability[0] and an ATOM/RSS feed. All the rest is part ego ("my content is so great people just have to see what else I wrote") and part feature creep. [0] https://www.sinax.be/blog/general/guidelines-for-spartan-webdesign.html https://www.sinax.be/blog/general/guidelines-for-spartan-web...

tehlike 7y ago
Except if you are ayende.com/blog
bishalb 7y ago
Sure, for a personal site or a portfolio site, they are not even needed. I also use Hugo for one of my sites, which is just a 5 page website. It is great for such stuff. But for a personal blog, I think both of those things(commenting and search) are absolutely essential. >Rarely have I seen interesting discussion happen in the comments of a personal blog. I disagree with this and even more so if we are talking about programming blogs. A lot of interesting discussions and rebuttals happen in the comment sections. Regarding outsourcing search to a dedicated search engine, its a mixed bag. 99% of the users don't even know about the `site:` and `filetype:` stuff. You also have the option of embedding Google site search but the first four results are ads which isn't very ideal. Wordpress search is decent out of the box but if you want something advanced, it has some nice plugins that allow advanced searching with fuzzy matches.
- majewsky 7y ago
  > But for a personal blog, I think both of those things(commenting and search) are absolutely essential. What I've found to work well for commenting is to put an e-mail address on the page where people can send their comments. When there is a good comment, I put an update in the article. The main advantage of this approach is that it weeds out garbage responses. By making it ever so slightly harder for people to post a comment, they are forced to take an extra few seconds to consider if they really have something meaningful to add.
  - bishalb 7y ago
    That is a good idea but would people really want to leave the site to open their email client and make a comment? I had once thought about a different approach - Creating a Google form (for each blog post) and then embedding it on the blog post. Then whenever anyone submits a comment via the form, it would get saved to a Google spreadsheet(this needs to be made publicly readable). The unwanted comments can just be deleted from the spreadsheet. The contents of this spreadsheet can then be obtained in a JSON format and displayed on the blog post using Javascript.
    - pier25 7y ago

pier25 7y ago

Those issues you mention can be easily solved with Jekyll or any other SSG. You do need a bit of hacking but the zero maintenance and raw speed of static sites is worth it IMO. I wouldn't go with Wordpress or any other CMS unless I absolutely needed permissions for multiple authors and such or if the author couldn't handle writing markdown and using a terminal command.

bishalb 7y ago
I am not sure how hacking Hugo or Jekyll could help me add commenting, searching etc. without using a third party service. Don't get me wrong, I still think they are great for small blogs and I use them myself as well for static sites but for a serious blog project or a money site, I think it is much more practical to go with a full blown solution like Wordpress. Regarding speed, with caching plugins and optionally with CDNs like cloudflare, Wordpress can be pretty fast. And for regular users who aren't tech savvy, hugo or jekyll are almost a no-go. >if the author couldn't handle writing markdown and using a terminal command. I would say this represents more than 99% of the bloggers. Even I prefer a WYSIWYG interface to markdown any day even though I consider myself somewhat tech-savvy. I find markdown to be very hacky when its a bit more than just headings and paragraphs(eg. nested lists with ordered list inside unordered list are so hard to do in markdown)
- pier25 7y ago
  > I am not sure how hacking Hugo or Jekyll could help me add commenting, searching etc. Searching should be left to Google. I'm skeptical blog users actually search on a site though I admit I've never seen any metrics about that. If you insist on having comments on your site and force users to sign-in etc this can be easily implemented with an API and some client-side code. > I would say this represents more than 99% of the bloggers. This thread is about HN users, not the general population. > I find markdown to be very hacky when its a bit more than just headings and paragraphs(eg. nested lists with ordered list inside unordered list are so hard to do in markdown) Well, no wonder you prefer Wordpress.
  - bishalb 7y ago

viraptor 7y ago

> virus affecting WordPress is much of a myth now There's still few every year https://wordpress.org/news/category/security/ https://wordpress.org/news/category/security/ And that's just the core WordPress. Plugins and themes carry their own issues. Reputable or not.

chebum 7y ago

Yes, the website starts to build slower with growing number of pages. I'm using Metalsmith static site generator for https://www.visualwatermark.com/ https://www.visualwatermark.com/ The website currently have about 400 pages and it takes 60-70 seconds to build it. Part of the problem is Metalsmith itself - the code in some parts is awful. I had to make some changes to make it work faster. Unfortunately, it's impossible to solve the underlying problem - you have to build the whole website at once, while WordPress builds pages on-demand. Also static generators aren't as convenient as WordPress is. I'm OK working with markdown or hacking the code, but it's too difficult for my wife, for example. So, she's running a WordPress blog. Commenting is also better on WordPress. She used to use Discuss for commenting and people are more to reluctant leave Discuss comments than to leave WordPress comments. I believe that's because you don't have to register to leave a comment in WordPress - just type your email and you're ready to go.