6 ms·

I have worked in similar locked-down environments. Phones, cameras, USB keys, and so on were all checked into lockers before entering the secure area, and this

I have worked in similar locked-down environments. Phones, cameras, USB keys, and so on were all checked into lockers before entering the secure area, and this was despite the fact that the computers had all their ports physically glued shut, and there were digital locks and snooping going on as well. At some level, you have to accept that things like Siri operate just like talking to human customer service representatives, who these days always begin conversations with a rote "This call may be recorded for quality and customer service purposes." What it comes down to is whether you trust the company to be unreasonably diligent in controlling what happens to these recordings. If there is a criticism to be levelled here, I think it is around the question of how well Apple and everyone else in this space allow consumers to make informed choices. Fine print in a voluminous user agreement is not nearly the same standard of disclosure as "Your words may be recorded for quality and customer service purposes" every time you say "Hey Siri." The latter may be impractical, of course, but perhaps there is a middle ground. It's not a dichotomy.

hnuser123456 7y ago
User: "Hey Siri" Siri: "We're listening"
kitchenkarma 7y ago
It's a bit naive thinking that employees would store their electronics in the lockers. Even if you have spot searches (including cavity search) it still doesn't exclude rogue employee just "forgetting" to store his or hers camera in the locker.
- braythwayt 7y ago
  Nobody in that business was naïve. Employees did not "forget," if they were caught with their phone in the secure area, they were fired. I was told right up front that certain things were zero tolerance, and everybody knew what they were. They took this very seriously. Now when it comes to a deliberately bad actor, well, nothing is 100% perfect, but there were many other security things going on that I am not going to describe here, plus I know for a fact that there were security measures they did not disclose to me. But let's face it: Somebody, somewhere, can train themselves to memorize a screen full of information. They could memorize something, go for a smoke break, and upload what they memorized. Lather, rinse, repeat. The point I made, and am still making, is that some companies care enough to do everything reasonably possible to keep customer data secure, while other companies do not. The company I described here cares. I believe Apple cares too. I suspect it will always be possible for someone to pull a small data heist, but extraordinarily difficult to set up a regular pipeline to exfiltrate data. The weak point is probably the digital systems. Most attackers would want everything, and the way to get everything is with a vulnerability.
tripzilch 7y ago
> you have to accept that things like Siri operate just like talking to human customer service representatives, who these days always begin conversations with a rote "This call may be recorded for quality and customer service purposes." Then why isn't it mandatory for Siri to start every conversation like that too?

hnuser123456 7y ago

User: "Hey Siri" Siri: "We're listening"

kitchenkarma 7y ago

It's a bit naive thinking that employees would store their electronics in the lockers. Even if you have spot searches (including cavity search) it still doesn't exclude rogue employee just "forgetting" to store his or hers camera in the locker.

braythwayt 7y ago
Nobody in that business was naïve. Employees did not "forget," if they were caught with their phone in the secure area, they were fired. I was told right up front that certain things were zero tolerance, and everybody knew what they were. They took this very seriously. Now when it comes to a deliberately bad actor, well, nothing is 100% perfect, but there were many other security things going on that I am not going to describe here, plus I know for a fact that there were security measures they did not disclose to me. But let's face it: Somebody, somewhere, can train themselves to memorize a screen full of information. They could memorize something, go for a smoke break, and upload what they memorized. Lather, rinse, repeat. The point I made, and am still making, is that some companies care enough to do everything reasonably possible to keep customer data secure, while other companies do not. The company I described here cares. I believe Apple cares too. I suspect it will always be possible for someone to pull a small data heist, but extraordinarily difficult to set up a regular pipeline to exfiltrate data. The weak point is probably the digital systems. Most attackers would want everything, and the way to get everything is with a vulnerability.

tripzilch 7y ago

> you have to accept that things like Siri operate just like talking to human customer service representatives, who these days always begin conversations with a rote "This call may be recorded for quality and customer service purposes." Then why isn't it mandatory for Siri to start every conversation like that too?