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It was much easier to move somewhere in the 19th century if you had the money. Its essentially impossible to move to another 1st world country without years (o

by throwaway2048 7y ago

It was much easier to move somewhere in the 19th century if you had the money. Its essentially impossible to move to another 1st world country without years (or decades) of process + usually a highly valued university degree these days

chaostheory 7y ago
Doesn't matter. imo Chinese people can still adapt. It's part of the culture. My family came to the US as illegal aliens with no money and poor education (their degrees weren't of much use). We still made it work. I know it's anecdotal, but there are a lot of anecdotes throughout Asia, Europe, the Americas, Africa, and even in the Middle East (it was surreal when I met a Chinese guy from Saudi Arabia who was looking for a potential 7th wife). EDIT: it wasn't easy immigrating the US in the 19th century https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Chinese_sentiment_in_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Chinese_sentiment_in_the_...
- FabHK 7y ago
  Don't understand why GP is downvoted. Of course Chinese people (like many others) can adapt, but how are you going into a country and stay there legally? For most people, asylum is hardly an option (though Germany has granted asylum to several leaders of the HK protests). If you don't go via asylum, you have to go via normal immigration routes, and they are normally either investment or skills based these days - you need lots of money or excellent education. You cannot just go and live in any country you want anymore (for most people).
  - chaostheory 7y ago
    > but how are you going into a country and stay there legally? The same way startups figure out how to survive and eventually profit: by continuously adapting and continuously looking for opportunity. In our case, some of my relatives saved up enough "under the counter" money to pay a citizen to marry them until they were able to get a green card; after which they divorced. Others just married citizens. Others got enough education to get a work visa (I don't remember the details). You get the picture. It's a waste of time and energy, dwelling on what you don't have vs how to accomplish what you need to happen. I'm not saying that you should be ignorant of obstacles and challenges (you need to know what they are), but you need to focus on the openings & opportunities to get through. This is a generalization, but I feel that most if not all Asian cultures have this same spirit. Here's a modern example. https://www.scmp.com/lifestyle/article/1774417/how-modern-day-chinese-migrants-are-making-new-life-italy https://www.scmp.com/lifestyle/article/1774417/how-modern-da... I didn't downvote anyone on this thread
    - FabHK 7y ago
      Ok, that's really funny. It would never in a million years occur to me to pay someone to marry me so I could live in some country. And, yes, some recent startups have skirted or crossed the line to illegality. My point remains - nowadays (unlike a century ago, if I'm not mistaken), the majority of people can not choose in which country to live (legally, at any rate).
      - chaostheory 7y ago
        The past is often romanticized, but the reality is that it was never easy. https://www.huffpost.com/entry/american-chinatowns-history_n_6090692 https://www.huffpost.com/entry/american-chinatowns-history_n... I didn't say that your point was invalid. I'm just pointing out that when you're desperate enough to escape an authoritarian regime or other dangers, legality isn't as important of a consideration. There's plenty of grey areas to work in. ie if there's a will, there's a way
naniwaduni 7y ago
It wasn't exactly easier to have the money in the 19th century?

chaostheory 7y ago

Doesn't matter. imo Chinese people can still adapt. It's part of the culture. My family came to the US as illegal aliens with no money and poor education (their degrees weren't of much use). We still made it work. I know it's anecdotal, but there are a lot of anecdotes throughout Asia, Europe, the Americas, Africa, and even in the Middle East (it was surreal when I met a Chinese guy from Saudi Arabia who was looking for a potential 7th wife). EDIT: it wasn't easy immigrating the US in the 19th century https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Chinese_sentiment_in_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Chinese_sentiment_in_the_...

FabHK 7y ago
Don't understand why GP is downvoted. Of course Chinese people (like many others) can adapt, but how are you going into a country and stay there legally? For most people, asylum is hardly an option (though Germany has granted asylum to several leaders of the HK protests). If you don't go via asylum, you have to go via normal immigration routes, and they are normally either investment or skills based these days - you need lots of money or excellent education. You cannot just go and live in any country you want anymore (for most people).
- chaostheory 7y ago
  > but how are you going into a country and stay there legally? The same way startups figure out how to survive and eventually profit: by continuously adapting and continuously looking for opportunity. In our case, some of my relatives saved up enough "under the counter" money to pay a citizen to marry them until they were able to get a green card; after which they divorced. Others just married citizens. Others got enough education to get a work visa (I don't remember the details). You get the picture. It's a waste of time and energy, dwelling on what you don't have vs how to accomplish what you need to happen. I'm not saying that you should be ignorant of obstacles and challenges (you need to know what they are), but you need to focus on the openings & opportunities to get through. This is a generalization, but I feel that most if not all Asian cultures have this same spirit. Here's a modern example. https://www.scmp.com/lifestyle/article/1774417/how-modern-day-chinese-migrants-are-making-new-life-italy https://www.scmp.com/lifestyle/article/1774417/how-modern-da... I didn't downvote anyone on this thread
  - FabHK 7y ago
    Ok, that's really funny. It would never in a million years occur to me to pay someone to marry me so I could live in some country. And, yes, some recent startups have skirted or crossed the line to illegality. My point remains - nowadays (unlike a century ago, if I'm not mistaken), the majority of people can not choose in which country to live (legally, at any rate).
    - chaostheory 7y ago
      The past is often romanticized, but the reality is that it was never easy. https://www.huffpost.com/entry/american-chinatowns-history_n_6090692 https://www.huffpost.com/entry/american-chinatowns-history_n... I didn't say that your point was invalid. I'm just pointing out that when you're desperate enough to escape an authoritarian regime or other dangers, legality isn't as important of a consideration. There's plenty of grey areas to work in. ie if there's a will, there's a way

naniwaduni 7y ago

It wasn't exactly easier to have the money in the 19th century?