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No, it's not, and I for one get fed up with this constant self-shaming, or "riich western country-shaming" attitude. The problem is the entire system. Of cour

No, it's not, and I for one get fed up with this constant self-shaming, or "riich western country-shaming" attitude. The problem is the entire system. Of course there is demand, but there is also supply. Each side must maintain standards, rather than just choosing the cheapest options. And both sides must hold each other accountable. Consumers must verify that production is sustainable, etc, and suppliers must insist on prices that support that, and reject quick-money offers/undercutting-schemes that undermine standards. In this particulr instance, I think there is a case (even an imperative) for "the west" to try to impose eco-tarrifs or eco-certifications etc on Brazilian beef, in order to pressure for more sustainable production practices.

esailija 7y ago
> Each side must maintain standards, rather than just choosing the cheapest options. People don't have infinite money. In fact 4.5 billion people don't make enough money not to be in qualitative extreme poverty[1] let alone enough money to be able to freely choose options that are not cheapest. Extremely small portion of total people have any actual freedom to choose options other than cheapest. > Consumers must verify that production is sustainable Such verification is impossible as it requires infinite time and perfect information. It is always cheaper and more profitable to lie about sustainability than to actually be sustainable. When one hole is fixed 10 more holes appear. 1. https://www.currentaffairs.org/2019/07/5-myths-about-global-poverty https://www.currentaffairs.org/2019/07/5-myths-about-global-...
- jacknews 7y ago
  By "consumers" I lean more toward "consuming countries". They should reject or penalize destructive products on behalf of individual consumers, just as they currently do for various product-safety standards. Perhaps in the same way as CITES for banning trading in endangered species, or the various timber certifications, which are certainly imperfect and "full of holes" but at least a start. I think tech could vastly improve systems of provenance. As I said, the system itself is at fault (as per your excellent link - thanks) - there will always be consumers wanting the cheapest price regardless, and suppliers willing to offer it, or even encouraging it (and certainly trying to hide the 'regardless' part of the equation). They must be stopped.

esailija 7y ago

> Each side must maintain standards, rather than just choosing the cheapest options. People don't have infinite money. In fact 4.5 billion people don't make enough money not to be in qualitative extreme poverty[1] let alone enough money to be able to freely choose options that are not cheapest. Extremely small portion of total people have any actual freedom to choose options other than cheapest. > Consumers must verify that production is sustainable Such verification is impossible as it requires infinite time and perfect information. It is always cheaper and more profitable to lie about sustainability than to actually be sustainable. When one hole is fixed 10 more holes appear. 1. https://www.currentaffairs.org/2019/07/5-myths-about-global-poverty https://www.currentaffairs.org/2019/07/5-myths-about-global-...

jacknews 7y ago
By "consumers" I lean more toward "consuming countries". They should reject or penalize destructive products on behalf of individual consumers, just as they currently do for various product-safety standards. Perhaps in the same way as CITES for banning trading in endangered species, or the various timber certifications, which are certainly imperfect and "full of holes" but at least a start. I think tech could vastly improve systems of provenance. As I said, the system itself is at fault (as per your excellent link - thanks) - there will always be consumers wanting the cheapest price regardless, and suppliers willing to offer it, or even encouraging it (and certainly trying to hide the 'regardless' part of the equation). They must be stopped.