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Have a look a low wage/low skill jobs. There is no such thing as security, employees are subject to their employer's benevolence. They even have to accept circu

Have a look a low wage/low skill jobs. There is no such thing as security, employees are subject to their employer's benevolence. They even have to accept circumstances that might violate laws. They can't fight it because they need the job, even if they hate it. I'm too busy to do the research for you, but Amazon warehouse workers are the first examples that come to my mind.

rubber_duck 7y ago
I've worked those jobs when I was younger - none of those people would feel any shame quitting for a better job so I'm not sure what your argument is.
- dkersten 7y ago
  Why should they? They're typically underpaid and in not so great conditions, but even if they aren't, why should they feel shape for quitting for a better job? If you fulfill your contractual obligations, you don't owe your employer anything and leaving any job for a better one is totally not something to be ashamed about. If anything, shame on the employer for doing a bad job in retaining their employees.
- wukerplank 7y ago
  > feel any shame quitting for a better job Yes and how do they find a better job without education? You are very fortunate that you were able leave that behind you. But do you realize there are millions of people in this world who have no means of pulling themselves out of the dirt?
  - simplecomplex 7y ago
    Never before has education been so cheap or widely available. The whole world’s information is available to anyone with an Internet connection.
    - wukerplank 7y ago
      Let me be sarcastic: Yes, it is very easy to have sufficiently fast internet (or even a computer) in a non-industrialized country. Even in the US it is perfectly viable to work 2-3 low wage jobs to keep your family fed and healthy and then bring up the energy to do a hacking boot camp. Also, because the basic education is so great in under developed regions regions, it is a breeze to grasp higher concepts of math. And analphabetism does not exist.
      - simplecomplex 7y ago
        Yes, life can be hard. And it’s unfair. It wasn’t easy or fair in preindustrial times. People worked a few hours less on average, but they received less wealth in exchange and had no opportunity to educate themselves and grow wealth. Serfs were not given a choice of job or even the ability to leave or marry without their lord’s permission. Peasants were stuck for life, unlike someone who works low paid 2-3 jobs today.
        wukerplank 7y ago
        So, what's your point?
    - dralley 7y ago
      >Never before has education been so cheap or widely available. Not the kind that counts to most employers (college degrees). That form of education has never been more expensive.
IG_Semmelweiss 7y ago
Have a look = outsider view Why speak if you have little experience in it? Maybe people with actual experience like the below poster will prove your inferences wrong
bko 7y ago
It’s the opposite. Low wage workers leave much more often than get fired. Consider Uber where drivers earn a very low net wage. Only 4% remain after a year. Maybe some are fired but I suspect he overwhelming majority just move on. Amazon has the highest turnover of any Fortune 500 company in 2013. That’s because their workers quit. They have options even at a low wage. That’s why they recently raised wages. https://www.cnbc.com/2017/04/20/only-4-percent-of-uber-drivers-remain-after-a-year-says-report.html https://www.cnbc.com/2017/04/20/only-4-percent-of-uber-drive... https://www.ibtimes.com/amazoncom-has-second-highest-employee-turnover-all-fortune-500-companies-1361257 https://www.ibtimes.com/amazoncom-has-second-highest-employe...
- lovich 7y ago
  If it's like when I worked menial jobs then the bosses just do something to make you quit like scheduling you for only 1 hour a week, assign you to only do the shit work that was previously spread out, etc. I think that muddies the water a bit in terms of those stats
  - monocasa 7y ago
    Yeah, they do that so you can't claim unemployment like you could have if they fired you.

rubber_duck 7y ago

I've worked those jobs when I was younger - none of those people would feel any shame quitting for a better job so I'm not sure what your argument is.

dkersten 7y ago
Why should they? They're typically underpaid and in not so great conditions, but even if they aren't, why should they feel shape for quitting for a better job? If you fulfill your contractual obligations, you don't owe your employer anything and leaving any job for a better one is totally not something to be ashamed about. If anything, shame on the employer for doing a bad job in retaining their employees.
wukerplank 7y ago
> feel any shame quitting for a better job Yes and how do they find a better job without education? You are very fortunate that you were able leave that behind you. But do you realize there are millions of people in this world who have no means of pulling themselves out of the dirt?
- simplecomplex 7y ago
  Never before has education been so cheap or widely available. The whole world’s information is available to anyone with an Internet connection.
  - wukerplank 7y ago
    Let me be sarcastic: Yes, it is very easy to have sufficiently fast internet (or even a computer) in a non-industrialized country. Even in the US it is perfectly viable to work 2-3 low wage jobs to keep your family fed and healthy and then bring up the energy to do a hacking boot camp. Also, because the basic education is so great in under developed regions regions, it is a breeze to grasp higher concepts of math. And analphabetism does not exist.
    - simplecomplex 7y ago
      Yes, life can be hard. And it’s unfair. It wasn’t easy or fair in preindustrial times. People worked a few hours less on average, but they received less wealth in exchange and had no opportunity to educate themselves and grow wealth. Serfs were not given a choice of job or even the ability to leave or marry without their lord’s permission. Peasants were stuck for life, unlike someone who works low paid 2-3 jobs today.
      - wukerplank 7y ago
        So, what's your point?
  - dralley 7y ago
    >Never before has education been so cheap or widely available. Not the kind that counts to most employers (college degrees). That form of education has never been more expensive.

IG_Semmelweiss 7y ago

Have a look = outsider view Why speak if you have little experience in it? Maybe people with actual experience like the below poster will prove your inferences wrong

bko 7y ago

It’s the opposite. Low wage workers leave much more often than get fired. Consider Uber where drivers earn a very low net wage. Only 4% remain after a year. Maybe some are fired but I suspect he overwhelming majority just move on. Amazon has the highest turnover of any Fortune 500 company in 2013. That’s because their workers quit. They have options even at a low wage. That’s why they recently raised wages. https://www.cnbc.com/2017/04/20/only-4-percent-of-uber-drivers-remain-after-a-year-says-report.html https://www.cnbc.com/2017/04/20/only-4-percent-of-uber-drive... https://www.ibtimes.com/amazoncom-has-second-highest-employee-turnover-all-fortune-500-companies-1361257 https://www.ibtimes.com/amazoncom-has-second-highest-employe...

lovich 7y ago
If it's like when I worked menial jobs then the bosses just do something to make you quit like scheduling you for only 1 hour a week, assign you to only do the shit work that was previously spread out, etc. I think that muddies the water a bit in terms of those stats
- monocasa 7y ago
  Yeah, they do that so you can't claim unemployment like you could have if they fired you.