4 ms·

You can't do anonymous ballots. With anonymous ballots, you can just "Find a box of ballots" and have no way to authenticate that they came from actual voters

by skrowl 7y ago

You can't do anonymous ballots. With anonymous ballots, you can just "Find a box of ballots" and have no way to authenticate that they came from actual voters vs fraudsters.

Slartie 7y ago
For some weird reason, Germany has been doing the impossible for decades now. Nobody "finds" boxes of ballots here, and all votes are cast anonymously. Several people in this thread have already explained how this magic trick works (registration book, each voter is ticked off, number of ballots from precincts are counted against ticked-off voters = can't find thousands of additional ballots).
- skrowl 7y ago
  Unfortunately that doesn't work in the United States. We regularly get precincts reporting more votes than are even possible given their total number of eligible voters. Fraud in anonymous voting states is rampant here.
  - mszkoda 7y ago
    Yep, there were several counties where they "found" extra ballots that they missed during the count in 2018 in the US. It was across both parties in multiple states wherein the "found" votes were heavily favoring one party or the other (a few were well outside 3 standard deviations from the current votes, even in areas that were normally not heavily favoring one side).
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]
  - Slartie 7y ago
    So you are basically saying it doesn't work because people in the US just don't care if there is obvious bullshit going on. Okay, great (or not so great for the self-acclaimed forefront of democracy), but why should that change if the votes aren't anonymous anymore? Why should people suddenly start to care if the results actually make any basic sense and aren't obviously either manipulated or erroneous? Any precinct reporting more votes than possible given the numbers of eligible voters is recounted. If the recounts can't manage to arrive at results that make any sense at all the entire precinct is ignored. Where's the problem?
  - 18pfsmt 7y ago
    As far as I know, the secret ballot is present in every state within the USA. Could you please cite your sources if you have different info (I've lived in 9 different states)?
jakeogh 7y ago
"Found" boxes of ballots have had their chain of custody broken, and must be thrown out. All interested parties should be able to follow the votes. Put them on a open trailer, covered with a clear tarp if necessary in transport.
beat 7y ago
You keep posting the "find a box of ballots" theory. It continues to be implausible and easily prevented without de-anonymizing the vote or resorting to strong voter ID.

by skrowl 7y ago

You can't do anonymous ballots. With anonymous ballots, you can just "Find a box of ballots" and have no way to authenticate that they came from actual voters vs fraudsters.

Slartie 7y ago

For some weird reason, Germany has been doing the impossible for decades now. Nobody "finds" boxes of ballots here, and all votes are cast anonymously. Several people in this thread have already explained how this magic trick works (registration book, each voter is ticked off, number of ballots from precincts are counted against ticked-off voters = can't find thousands of additional ballots).

skrowl 7y ago
Unfortunately that doesn't work in the United States. We regularly get precincts reporting more votes than are even possible given their total number of eligible voters. Fraud in anonymous voting states is rampant here.
- mszkoda 7y ago
  Yep, there were several counties where they "found" extra ballots that they missed during the count in 2018 in the US. It was across both parties in multiple states wherein the "found" votes were heavily favoring one party or the other (a few were well outside 3 standard deviations from the current votes, even in areas that were normally not heavily favoring one side).
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
- Slartie 7y ago
  So you are basically saying it doesn't work because people in the US just don't care if there is obvious bullshit going on. Okay, great (or not so great for the self-acclaimed forefront of democracy), but why should that change if the votes aren't anonymous anymore? Why should people suddenly start to care if the results actually make any basic sense and aren't obviously either manipulated or erroneous? Any precinct reporting more votes than possible given the numbers of eligible voters is recounted. If the recounts can't manage to arrive at results that make any sense at all the entire precinct is ignored. Where's the problem?
- 18pfsmt 7y ago
  As far as I know, the secret ballot is present in every state within the USA. Could you please cite your sources if you have different info (I've lived in 9 different states)?

jakeogh 7y ago

"Found" boxes of ballots have had their chain of custody broken, and must be thrown out. All interested parties should be able to follow the votes. Put them on a open trailer, covered with a clear tarp if necessary in transport.

beat 7y ago

You keep posting the "find a box of ballots" theory. It continues to be implausible and easily prevented without de-anonymizing the vote or resorting to strong voter ID.