3 ms·
Having observed both sides of the industry first hand, I don't agree with that statement at all. Without going into debates on relative merit, RISC-V does its
by tpearson-raptor 7y ago
Having observed both sides of the industry first hand, I don't agree with that statement at all. Without going into debates on relative merit, RISC-V does its development in public while IBM until very recently has done it all behind closed tightly sealed doors. This might be giving a slightly unfair comparison on size of teams from a public perspective.
The IBM folks really, REALLY understand how to design a secure core and chip, plus the decades learning how to make a fast and relatively efficient core. RISC-V is simply in a far more nascent state, trying to push it to POWER9 performance (let alone AMD performance) is like saying a toddler just learning to walk will win a 10k marathon tomorrow. Eventually that may happen, but not in one day, more like 20 years. ;). And when you start chasing performance, who is doing the actual hard, tedious work of verification and making sure security flaws aren't being accidentally introduced into the implementation?
POWER is interesting to me because we get mature tooling on a proven ISA that can be built and run on high performance chips today. No more cross compiling, no more pure emulation required to do soft core work. That in and of itself is huge in the embedded space, and honestly I'd love to see the experimental and interesting cores currently decoding RISC-V ported to decode ppc64 -- all the sudden real comparisons on performance etc. for identical binaries become possible, allowing proper comparison of core design ideas under real world loading. No more guessing and having to take on pure faith that the performance difference is down to ISA or compiler performance -- either your core is faster / more efficient on the sane binary, or it's not!
- gumby 7y agoOh I don’t disagree with what you wrote except on one crucial point. Certainly agree that RISC-V is still in its baby shoes. But IBM’s announcement is simply the ISA itself being open sourced (with some patent IP). Apart from an FPGA soft core there’s no RTL/VHDL. If you want to make silicon you’ll be starting basically from scratch.
- tpearson-raptor 7y agoSure. While I would also like to see a real hard core or three released, here's my frame challenge: What if the existing RISC-V and other academic cores are already good enough for a lot of people? The instruction decoder is a relatively small part of the CPU, swap that out and you suddenly get new SoCs that can run the existing POWER software base (that means proven toolchains, vector accelerated applications, etc.). Right now RISC-V doesn't even have vector instructions per se; adding all that support to the entire tooling seems like a lot of effort for not much gain when you can simply implement VSX in the hardware and use the existing tooling for it. I keep hearing the open RISC-V cores are going to be very fast very soon. If that's true, how would an IBM provided core help versus an instruction decoder swap on one of those and some tuning?