5 ms·

I wouldn't drool over it. See the latest benchmarks comparing it to epyc and Intel. Power9 does pretty poorly throughout almost every test: https://www.phoroni

I wouldn't drool over it. See the latest benchmarks comparing it to epyc and Intel. Power9 does pretty poorly throughout almost every test: https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=rome-power9-arm&num=1 https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=rome-pow...

tpearson-raptor 7y ago
Both of those processors insist on you ceding full system control to the vendor in perpetuity, with a literal "skeleton key" that let's the vendor in and keeps you out (the centrally signed, unremovable ME/PSP). If this doesn't concern you, then why are you looking at a local machine at all when a cloud system may very well be less expensive to lease than to purchase and keep current, not to mention run, local hardware? Unless you're loading the local machine 24/7, you're leaving a resource sitting idle for parts of the day without any real increase in security or control, meaning the cloud vendor can give you a cheaper experience overall by keeping hardware utilization over time high. And no, ME cleaner does NOT (and cannot) fully remove a modern ME. The PSP "disable" toggle in the UEFI configuration does NOT disable the PSP from running during startup.
- wolfgke 7y ago
  > why are you looking at a local machine at all when a cloud system may very well be less expensive to lease than to purchase and keep current, not to mention run, local hardware? Because a cloud machine is rented and not owned. And because of the ping latency: there is a reason why there is for example still hardly any cloud gaming.
  - tpearson-raptor 7y ago
    And what exactly do you call a machine that you are, by design, cryptographically locked out of, but a third party has access to? Put another way, would you call a car that I kept duplicate keys and retained title for, but said you could use and maintain at your sole expense for a single upfront payment, rented or owned? Latency is being solved, Google etc. are working that problem. I'm playing devils advocate here, but fundamentally if you don't care about actually controlling or being able to modify something, and pricing is cheaper to rent, why own?
    - wolfgke 7y ago
      > And what exactly do you call a machine that you are, by design, cryptographically locked out of, but a third party has access to? Not a perfect solution, but such a problem can be mitigated by a firewall that blocks such ingoing/outgoing packets. > I'm playing devils advocate here, but fundamentally if you don't care about actually controlling or being able to modify something, and pricing is cheaper to rent, why own? Since I love to tinker with my computers, the answer is obvious to me.
- shaklee3 7y ago
  I think this is apples and oranges. Sure, if those kinds of things are that important to you, then POWER9 is your only option. But if performance is important, POWER9 is a longshot from being the best. Most companies likely don't care about the things you're suggesting.
beezle 7y ago
My understanding is that it is not really useful to compare Power9 to other cpus in these types of benchmarks, that Power9 is all about computation with massive datasets, not how fast it can zip a file.
- Recurecur 7y ago
  > My understanding is that it is not really useful to compare Power9 to other cpus in these types of benchmarks, that Power9 is all about computation with massive datasets, not how fast it can zip a file. Your understanding is wrong. For instance, running Java workloads on servers is a major Power9 use case. The thing to remember, though, is that the Talos is only two four-core CPUs, for eight total. These benchmarks are comparing it to the Epyc 7742, which is a 64 core chip. Naturally the Epyc will kill it on most highly threaded benchmarks. The individual cores on Power9 are quite fast, though.
  - fluffything 7y ago
    > The individual cores on Power9 are quite fast, though. Are there any benchmarks for single thread performance there that I could see ?

tpearson-raptor 7y ago

Both of those processors insist on you ceding full system control to the vendor in perpetuity, with a literal "skeleton key" that let's the vendor in and keeps you out (the centrally signed, unremovable ME/PSP). If this doesn't concern you, then why are you looking at a local machine at all when a cloud system may very well be less expensive to lease than to purchase and keep current, not to mention run, local hardware? Unless you're loading the local machine 24/7, you're leaving a resource sitting idle for parts of the day without any real increase in security or control, meaning the cloud vendor can give you a cheaper experience overall by keeping hardware utilization over time high. And no, ME cleaner does NOT (and cannot) fully remove a modern ME. The PSP "disable" toggle in the UEFI configuration does NOT disable the PSP from running during startup.

wolfgke 7y ago
> why are you looking at a local machine at all when a cloud system may very well be less expensive to lease than to purchase and keep current, not to mention run, local hardware? Because a cloud machine is rented and not owned. And because of the ping latency: there is a reason why there is for example still hardly any cloud gaming.
- tpearson-raptor 7y ago
  And what exactly do you call a machine that you are, by design, cryptographically locked out of, but a third party has access to? Put another way, would you call a car that I kept duplicate keys and retained title for, but said you could use and maintain at your sole expense for a single upfront payment, rented or owned? Latency is being solved, Google etc. are working that problem. I'm playing devils advocate here, but fundamentally if you don't care about actually controlling or being able to modify something, and pricing is cheaper to rent, why own?
  - wolfgke 7y ago
    > And what exactly do you call a machine that you are, by design, cryptographically locked out of, but a third party has access to? Not a perfect solution, but such a problem can be mitigated by a firewall that blocks such ingoing/outgoing packets. > I'm playing devils advocate here, but fundamentally if you don't care about actually controlling or being able to modify something, and pricing is cheaper to rent, why own? Since I love to tinker with my computers, the answer is obvious to me.
shaklee3 7y ago
I think this is apples and oranges. Sure, if those kinds of things are that important to you, then POWER9 is your only option. But if performance is important, POWER9 is a longshot from being the best. Most companies likely don't care about the things you're suggesting.

beezle 7y ago

My understanding is that it is not really useful to compare Power9 to other cpus in these types of benchmarks, that Power9 is all about computation with massive datasets, not how fast it can zip a file.

Recurecur 7y ago
> My understanding is that it is not really useful to compare Power9 to other cpus in these types of benchmarks, that Power9 is all about computation with massive datasets, not how fast it can zip a file. Your understanding is wrong. For instance, running Java workloads on servers is a major Power9 use case. The thing to remember, though, is that the Talos is only two four-core CPUs, for eight total. These benchmarks are comparing it to the Epyc 7742, which is a 64 core chip. Naturally the Epyc will kill it on most highly threaded benchmarks. The individual cores on Power9 are quite fast, though.
- fluffything 7y ago
  > The individual cores on Power9 are quite fast, though. Are there any benchmarks for single thread performance there that I could see ?