okmokmz said: > there are a ton of assumptions in this argument, and you seem to be projecting a lot of your personal beliefs and feeling as well I agree and

okmokmz said: > there are a ton of assumptions in this argument, and you seem to be projecting a lot of your personal beliefs and feeling as well I agree and I wanted to walk through the differences in my life (as I'm 80% remote): > If you don't have a dedicated quiet office area then it gets real difficult. I agree, but it's not hard to create this environment at home. Buy a house with one more bedroom than you need and make it an office. That's what I've done. > Pets are a distraction. Our dog doesn't come into my office when I'm working. > Other people in the home are a distraction (and it's not their fault, they have the right to "be at home".) I've got three kids. My wife homeschools our children, so they are home all the time. They're all elementary and middle-school age. They are going to be kids and do what they do, even if I asked them not to. And yet this is almost never a distraction for me. Even on calls 90% of the time my audio is far cleaner than my co-workers who are in an open office. This does require understanding and support from my wife, but she's an adult and we're on the same page. This is what we, together, want. When my office door is locked I'm "at work" and she and the kids don't bother me except for emergencies, just like she wouldn't call me at work if I was in the office except for emergencies. On the other hand, I get to "come home" for lunch every day. > If you have a significant other living at home full time and that person is in a grumpy mood, then good luck. As mentioned in the last point, when I'm in my office I'm "at work." Grumpy or not my wife isn't going to bother me. This isn't something special about remote. It's a normal part of maturing in a relationship. Being grumpy is not a good enough reason to call your spouse at work in the middle of their day. It's no different if I'm remote. > I feel that people who can make it work are those who either live in a cave with no other living creatures or they have the bread to get a big enough house and funds to create an operations center in a dedicated room. OK, snark aside, having a dedicated space does make everything easier. But first this isn't that expensive in the grand scheme of things if you are intentional about it. The cost of housing can vary quite a bit, but being remote gives you a lot more flexibility to find an affordable, comfortable home that has space for a dedicated office. Second, even without a dedicated room for an office you can make it work. For several years I worked from my bedroom. I had a corner where I setup my "office" and during the work day the bedroom was my office. I will concede that there are many things about this that are not ideal, but it's not as black-and-white-bad-idea as you're making it out to be. It's not like the office is a magically ideal workplace without its own drawbacks. Personally I would much rather deal with the inconveniences of a less than ideal home office than those of the open plan office that is common nowadays. It's not even a comparison for me. > The communication you do have is much more mercenary. This just doesn't match my experience at all. Communication does require more effort in a remote setting, that's true. But in my experience being in the office is not a guarantee that healthy communication with happen. Putting in the effort to communicate intentionally (not just a byproduct of co-location) is valuable either way. I will concede that face-to-face is the king for building relationships. However, this is not a daily need. Also I don't need work to provide a social setting. I've already got more than enough friends and family to "socialize" with outside of work. I do value good relationships with my coworkers and I do like having a chance to meet them in person but we don't need to be BFFs to have a good and productive working relationship. > you don't get to see her world class key short-cut skills from which you could open up a whole new way of thinking about your own operations. 1. No but I can read Tim's blog post about the same subject. 2. I find it a bit rude to be watching other people's monitors as they work so I wouldn't see this anyways. > You don't see the real pressure your boss or manager is under and you get far less information about how things work because they won't be casually confiding in you at the water cooler. 1. Intentional communication addresses some of this. 2. Being in the same location doesn't necessarily get you this. I'm thinking, for example, of the time half the engineering team got laid off on a Friday with no warning. This was a "collaborative open office" company that didn't offer remote. Communication is always critical for a healthy and productive organization. Co-locating provides enough chatter built-in to obfuscate poor communication patterns. And yet poor communication remains one of the main causes of failed and over-budget software systems, even in co-located teams. Remote just makes it more obvious when teams don't know how to communicate. > You don't need a NORAD display to show major events and weather conditions around the world to see what challenges your collaborators will be up against in getting things done the coming day. What? I'm not even looking at the weather for the city I'm in. If my coworkers have a challenge we just talk about it. > Remote work kind of sucks. Work in general these days kind of sucks. In my opinion remote is the saving grace of our industry. I'm at the point I won't even consider a job unless it has either a private office or allows a minimum of 60% remote.