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There are decades of history behind every criticism of PHP? Do you just want people to ignore them? PHP can be a bit of a punching bag, even when it's not topi

There are decades of history behind every criticism of PHP? Do you just want people to ignore them? PHP can be a bit of a punching bag, even when it's not topical. But it's not exactly unwarranted.

mobilemidget 7y ago
You almost imply as if there is a scripting or programming language that is perfect and free of any criticism or disadvantage?
- sterileopinions 7y ago
  Where do I do that?
taneq 7y ago
A lot of the criticisms were perfectly valid security concerns (some of the old default behaviour was insecure by design). Fortunately the language has evolved a lot and is nowhere near as bad as it once was. Also a lot of the criticisms were based on PHP being an easy "beginner language" and so being used by a lot of people who had no idea what they were doing. If people have valid criticisms of modern PHP then by all means air them, but don't go ragging on the language in 2019 for problems with PHP written in 2004.
- sterileopinions 7y ago
  > but don't go ragging on the language in 2019 for problems with PHP written in 2004. Reputations can be unfair. But there are many characteristics that many developers still find unsavory about PHP, a lot of them fundamental to the language. It's a bit silly to put a time cap on those characteristics that just aren't going to change. It's really silly to assume people are going to change their tune on a tech stack many actively choose to avoid and have no way of caring or seeing what's changed within the last 3 or so years.
  - notyourday 7y ago
    > Reputations can be unfair. But there are many characteristics that many developers still find unsavory about PHP, a lot of them fundamental to the language. Unless the software developers are paid to wax poetically about those unsavory features rather than affect whatever gets the $$ in the door to pay the software developers salaries "Lolz, lookz at PHPz stupid." is irrelevant.
    - sterileopinions 7y ago
      Most people don't get paid to post opinions on the internet, or any kind of public forum.
mrunkel 7y ago
Those decades of history are largely talking about a PHP that doesn't exist any more. Yes, the language has it's warts, but if you think $language doesn't, you're just new to it. There are many large PHP projects that generate tons of revenue. New frameworks like Laravel and Symfony 4 make whipping out MVPs that can scale pretty damn easy.
- sterileopinions 7y ago
  >There are many large PHP projects that generate tons of revenue. Okay, but that doesn't negate any of the criticisms about PHP nor does it suddenly wipe out decades of built up reputation.
dangerface 7y ago
Every language has valid criticism, you use the right tool for the right job. When you single out one of your tools as "bad" it just highlights that you don't understand what job the tool is for. learn your tools.
- sterileopinions 7y ago
  You're assuming the criticisms between different languages are equatable. It's important to understand that there is a reputation and perception that PHP has because of its colored history. Invoking platitudes like "the right tool for the job" is irrelevant and isn't going to make that history go away suddenly.
  - dangerface 7y ago
    > It's important to understand that there is a reputation and perception that PHP has because of its colored history. Because no other language has a history? Look at C it has a coloured history, it has a reputation like any other language, C vs C++, it has bad things like the lack of memory safety, it lacks concepts like object orientation and so on and so on. No PHP is not special in its flaws.
- triceratops 7y ago
  It's funny you should mention tools. This article uses exactly that analogy to explain why PHP is an awful tool for any job. https://eev.ee/blog/2012/04/09/php-a-fractal-of-bad-design/ https://eev.ee/blog/2012/04/09/php-a-fractal-of-bad-design/
  - arpa 7y ago
    Actually, hating on PHP is much older. Heck, if we are to descend into depths of history, let's go straight to the unix haters' handbook and let's find out just why the most ubiquitous and popular server operating system sucks on the most fundamental level.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]

There are decades of history behind every criticism of PHP? Do you just want people to ignore them? PHP can be a bit of a punching bag, even when it's not topical. But it's not exactly unwarranted.

mobilemidget 7y ago

You almost imply as if there is a scripting or programming language that is perfect and free of any criticism or disadvantage?

sterileopinions 7y ago
Where do I do that?

taneq 7y ago

A lot of the criticisms were perfectly valid security concerns (some of the old default behaviour was insecure by design). Fortunately the language has evolved a lot and is nowhere near as bad as it once was. Also a lot of the criticisms were based on PHP being an easy "beginner language" and so being used by a lot of people who had no idea what they were doing. If people have valid criticisms of modern PHP then by all means air them, but don't go ragging on the language in 2019 for problems with PHP written in 2004.

sterileopinions 7y ago
> but don't go ragging on the language in 2019 for problems with PHP written in 2004. Reputations can be unfair. But there are many characteristics that many developers still find unsavory about PHP, a lot of them fundamental to the language. It's a bit silly to put a time cap on those characteristics that just aren't going to change. It's really silly to assume people are going to change their tune on a tech stack many actively choose to avoid and have no way of caring or seeing what's changed within the last 3 or so years.
- notyourday 7y ago
  > Reputations can be unfair. But there are many characteristics that many developers still find unsavory about PHP, a lot of them fundamental to the language. Unless the software developers are paid to wax poetically about those unsavory features rather than affect whatever gets the $$ in the door to pay the software developers salaries "Lolz, lookz at PHPz stupid." is irrelevant.
  - sterileopinions 7y ago
    Most people don't get paid to post opinions on the internet, or any kind of public forum.

mrunkel 7y ago

Those decades of history are largely talking about a PHP that doesn't exist any more. Yes, the language has it's warts, but if you think $language doesn't, you're just new to it. There are many large PHP projects that generate tons of revenue. New frameworks like Laravel and Symfony 4 make whipping out MVPs that can scale pretty damn easy.

sterileopinions 7y ago
>There are many large PHP projects that generate tons of revenue. Okay, but that doesn't negate any of the criticisms about PHP nor does it suddenly wipe out decades of built up reputation.

dangerface 7y ago

Every language has valid criticism, you use the right tool for the right job. When you single out one of your tools as "bad" it just highlights that you don't understand what job the tool is for. learn your tools.

sterileopinions 7y ago
You're assuming the criticisms between different languages are equatable. It's important to understand that there is a reputation and perception that PHP has because of its colored history. Invoking platitudes like "the right tool for the job" is irrelevant and isn't going to make that history go away suddenly.
- dangerface 7y ago
  > It's important to understand that there is a reputation and perception that PHP has because of its colored history. Because no other language has a history? Look at C it has a coloured history, it has a reputation like any other language, C vs C++, it has bad things like the lack of memory safety, it lacks concepts like object orientation and so on and so on. No PHP is not special in its flaws.
triceratops 7y ago
It's funny you should mention tools. This article uses exactly that analogy to explain why PHP is an awful tool for any job. https://eev.ee/blog/2012/04/09/php-a-fractal-of-bad-design/ https://eev.ee/blog/2012/04/09/php-a-fractal-of-bad-design/
- arpa 7y ago
  Actually, hating on PHP is much older. Heck, if we are to descend into depths of history, let's go straight to the unix haters' handbook and let's find out just why the most ubiquitous and popular server operating system sucks on the most fundamental level.

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]