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That's a very misleading quote. The new Home Secretary wants to institute a different regime from day one of no deal, which deviates from original plans and cr

That's a very misleading quote. The new Home Secretary wants to institute a different regime from day one of no deal, which deviates from original plans and creates a whole range of issues for EU nationals with and without settled status who are resident. While it is aimed at voters to show that they'll be treating new arrivals differently, the systems and laws and all of the bodies that deal with EU nationals are not equipped to differentiate between existing residents and new arrivals. Only about a third of EU nationals have applied for settled status and this new messaging from the incoming Home Secretary is saying the hostile environment measures must be eagerly applied to all EU nationals without it. Employers, landlords, banks, health service providers and border officials all have the burden to verify a person's legal status and the majority of EU nationals will be unable to demonstrate their status from day one. Their status furthermore isn't protected by primary legislation and for most people only amounts to being in a digital system that must be checked online. Most parties involved in having to check resident's status is not trained in doing that, in so far it is even practicable from day one of no deal. And it most certainly will create discrimination, making it more likely that those that have a harder time demonstrating their rights will be unfairly rejected or skipped over, or be faced with additional burdens to prove status. The real world consequences for people affected could be not finding a place to rent, being evicted, losing a bank account or being unable to open one, being denied health services or being asked to pay for services that should be free, being denied a job, being let go, or simply being skipped over by employers. This all can happen to people who have been in the UK for decades but are unable to easily demonstrate their status. This is not hypothetical stuff, this already happens but the occurrence would jump up by an order of magnitude as the result of the course taken here.

heavenlyblue 7y ago
If only a third a third of the EU nationals applied it means they didn’t want to apply in the first place. The whole process take about 15 minutes, especially if you have an social insurance number.
- tonyedgecombe 7y ago
  Or they don't intend to stay. I wonder what the consequences of a mass exodus would be.
  - Zenst 7y ago
    Well, if the seas part and they walk across the channel then I'd say people would start taking note. But humour aside, those leaving have already done so and https://fullfact.org/immigration/eu-citizens-brexodus/ https://fullfact.org/immigration/eu-citizens-brexodus/
    - tonyedgecombe 7y ago
      But humour aside, those leaving have already done so It wasn't very funny and we don't really know what will happen.
    - yread 7y ago
      They won't be able to leave because of the chaos on the EU/UK border after wild Brexit. Problem solved.
- mytailorisrich 7y ago
  People have until end of 2020 to apply. Considering the mess and flip-flopping it is reasonable not to rush.
- pknight 7y ago
  Nobody should be pleased about applying in the first place, as it formalises a lesser status than people had previously. And it may take 15 minutes if you have had continuous employment or have been drawing benefits with no gaps at all for five years AND they are able to verify that in an automated way. Hundreds of thousands will be spending much more time on their application. And although the overall process is pretty lenient and fairly well done, many people are going to have trouble with it. If you fall under a less certain scenario, you may be reluctant to apply at all, because it doesn't guarantee you'll get approved and the consequences of not being approved are daunting. Under no deal, failure to be accepted for settled status equates to being officially recognised as a resident with no workable legal status and that is a very, very bad place to be in. And if you don't apply by the end of 2020, you lose out altogether under current plans. Note that with 3 million EU citizens, plenty of people are simply not even aware of the consequences or the need to apply in the first place.
pjc50 7y ago
> The real world consequences for people affected could be not finding a place to rent, being evicted, losing a bank account or being unable to open one, being denied health services or being asked to pay for services that should be free, being denied a job, being let go, or simply being skipped over by employers. This all can happen to people who have been in the UK for decades but are unable to easily demonstrate their status. This is not hypothetical stuff, this already happens but the occurrence would jump up by an order of magnitude as the result of the course taken here. Yup. This is setting up for Windrush fiasco all over again, just on a much larger scale.
makomk 7y ago
This new messaging isn't saying that the hostile environment measures must be applied to all EU nationals - you're right that would be a much bigger deal, but there's nothing in the article saying that would happen. The existing plan is that employers, landlords and other third parties won't be asked to check the status of EU citizens until the end of 2020, and this doesn't change that - it just changes restrictions at the borders themselves. If there's ever an indication that will change you won't have to read between the lines to spot it because it'll be right there in the headlines.
- pknight 7y ago
  Patel's stated intentions imply the extension of all of the hostile environment measures. She wants to end freedom of movement instantly, even though it had been presumed to be effectively applied for an interim period even with no deal and no transition. She wants to explicitly kill the notion of a grace period, which had been presumed to apply before. The reporting is light on details, because the 'how' has not been drawn up yet. What has been newly decided is to immediately kill freedom of movement in practice. And the UK does most of its border controls behind the border, by making landlords, banks, hospitals and doctors do checks. Even if what Patel means to implement is purely what border officials at airports do to check people's status as they come in (and I very much doubt this is all she intends), it reinforces the message to employers, health service providers, banks and landlords that EU nationals are a higher liability if they turn out not to have the required status. The Govt may very well even advise landlords for instance that they won't hold them to account with the usual criminal penalties for accidentally renting to a EU national without settled status or other valid migration status, many landlords will simply eschew EU nationals going forward because it's safer. Messaging like this underlines that a EU ID is no longer a sufficient signal that a person is in all likelihood a legal resident and that a tough line is meant to be taken against EU nationals.

heavenlyblue 7y ago

If only a third a third of the EU nationals applied it means they didn’t want to apply in the first place. The whole process take about 15 minutes, especially if you have an social insurance number.

tonyedgecombe 7y ago
Or they don't intend to stay. I wonder what the consequences of a mass exodus would be.
- Zenst 7y ago
  Well, if the seas part and they walk across the channel then I'd say people would start taking note. But humour aside, those leaving have already done so and https://fullfact.org/immigration/eu-citizens-brexodus/ https://fullfact.org/immigration/eu-citizens-brexodus/
  - tonyedgecombe 7y ago
    But humour aside, those leaving have already done so It wasn't very funny and we don't really know what will happen.
  - yread 7y ago
    They won't be able to leave because of the chaos on the EU/UK border after wild Brexit. Problem solved.
mytailorisrich 7y ago
People have until end of 2020 to apply. Considering the mess and flip-flopping it is reasonable not to rush.
pknight 7y ago
Nobody should be pleased about applying in the first place, as it formalises a lesser status than people had previously. And it may take 15 minutes if you have had continuous employment or have been drawing benefits with no gaps at all for five years AND they are able to verify that in an automated way. Hundreds of thousands will be spending much more time on their application. And although the overall process is pretty lenient and fairly well done, many people are going to have trouble with it. If you fall under a less certain scenario, you may be reluctant to apply at all, because it doesn't guarantee you'll get approved and the consequences of not being approved are daunting. Under no deal, failure to be accepted for settled status equates to being officially recognised as a resident with no workable legal status and that is a very, very bad place to be in. And if you don't apply by the end of 2020, you lose out altogether under current plans. Note that with 3 million EU citizens, plenty of people are simply not even aware of the consequences or the need to apply in the first place.

pjc50 7y ago

> The real world consequences for people affected could be not finding a place to rent, being evicted, losing a bank account or being unable to open one, being denied health services or being asked to pay for services that should be free, being denied a job, being let go, or simply being skipped over by employers. This all can happen to people who have been in the UK for decades but are unable to easily demonstrate their status. This is not hypothetical stuff, this already happens but the occurrence would jump up by an order of magnitude as the result of the course taken here. Yup. This is setting up for Windrush fiasco all over again, just on a much larger scale.

makomk 7y ago

This new messaging isn't saying that the hostile environment measures must be applied to all EU nationals - you're right that would be a much bigger deal, but there's nothing in the article saying that would happen. The existing plan is that employers, landlords and other third parties won't be asked to check the status of EU citizens until the end of 2020, and this doesn't change that - it just changes restrictions at the borders themselves. If there's ever an indication that will change you won't have to read between the lines to spot it because it'll be right there in the headlines.

pknight 7y ago
Patel's stated intentions imply the extension of all of the hostile environment measures. She wants to end freedom of movement instantly, even though it had been presumed to be effectively applied for an interim period even with no deal and no transition. She wants to explicitly kill the notion of a grace period, which had been presumed to apply before. The reporting is light on details, because the 'how' has not been drawn up yet. What has been newly decided is to immediately kill freedom of movement in practice. And the UK does most of its border controls behind the border, by making landlords, banks, hospitals and doctors do checks. Even if what Patel means to implement is purely what border officials at airports do to check people's status as they come in (and I very much doubt this is all she intends), it reinforces the message to employers, health service providers, banks and landlords that EU nationals are a higher liability if they turn out not to have the required status. The Govt may very well even advise landlords for instance that they won't hold them to account with the usual criminal penalties for accidentally renting to a EU national without settled status or other valid migration status, many landlords will simply eschew EU nationals going forward because it's safer. Messaging like this underlines that a EU ID is no longer a sufficient signal that a person is in all likelihood a legal resident and that a tough line is meant to be taken against EU nationals.