8 ms·

Marium, the Dugong Who Charmed Thailand, Dies After Ingesting Plastic

91 points by laurex 7y ago

atsushin 7y ago
I'm doubtful that humanity will be able to resolve its plastics crisis without a radical, 'immediate' shift in how nations manufacture and consume product. No matter what great research or innovations exist or are on the horizon, we've long passed the point of no return and are entrenched in our habits. There's been a profusion of news illustrating how egregious our situation is and I'm always left wondering how the future is going to look like and in what new ways people are going to adapt.
mrnobody_67 7y ago
We need biodegradable plastic bottles now, and an outright ban on styrofoam....
- Sawamara 7y ago
  Biodegradability means nothing in the context of plastic that ends up in rivers, seas and oceans. Nothing. That is not a solution. We need waste control, enforced harsh laws on producers (industries and tourists and waste manager companies), and we needed it a decade ago. This is what happens when capitalism relies on an externality and that externality is fed up with its bullcrap.
pvaldes 7y ago
Moral of the history: Nothing can substitute mother's lessons about what to eat and what not. Orphans of species that need a long period of weaning and teaching have more probabilities of die young.
- rexpop 7y ago
  You think the moral has nothing to do with our deliberate industries?
jaggederest 7y ago
I think it's a decent bet that future generations will see our usage of plastic in the past few decades pretty similarly to the way we see the historical usage of asbestos during the middle part of the 20th century.
- romaaeterna 7y ago
  Agreed, but as a practical matter, we should be clear about where the vast majority of Ocean plastic comes from. https://i.imgur.com/D60ySOI.png https://i.imgur.com/D60ySOI.png
  - contingencies 7y ago
    That data is suspect.
    - contingencies 7y ago
      Knowing there is no way those numbers are right I point out it's dodgy looking, get viciously downvoted (probably by some kind of yay US crowd who dislike people living in China having an opinion) but when the source is quoted has literally been corrected by its own authors.[0] Typical HN. [0] https://pubs.acs.org/doi/suppl/10.1021/acs.est.7b06377/suppl_file/es7b06377_si_002.pdf https://pubs.acs.org/doi/suppl/10.1021/acs.est.7b06377/suppl...
      - romaaeterna 7y ago
        I don't know what is "typical HN", but what you have linked to was only a correction in the table headings. They say in the correction notice that it "does not affect the data, only the table headings." They had switched "Model 1" and "Model 2" in the original. https://pubs.acs.org/doi/10.1021/acs.est.7b06377 https://pubs.acs.org/doi/10.1021/acs.est.7b06377
        contingencies 7y ago
        OK. Actually the reason I felt it was unlikely to be correct was that I have lived in both river deltas (a year each in Shanghai, Shenzhen, Zhuhai) as well as travelled extensively (Suzhou, Yangzhou, upper Yangtse, Jiangmen, etc.) and suspect given the manufacturing and residential density and geographic expanse of the lower PRD, it should have significant garbage versus Yangtse. How was the data gathered? Satellite? When was it gathered? The 2017 paper probably uses 2015 or earlier data, there have been substantial improvements on environmental issues in the PRD region (really China-wide) of late, but I'd still be surprised if it's substantially cleaner in plastic refuse terms than the Yangtse.
RcouF1uZ4gsC 7y ago
>But last week, her caregivers found her listless and bruised, reports the AP. >In addition to Marium eating plastic, biologists believe she was pursued by an overly aggressive male during the mating season. >"We assume she wandered off too far from her natural habitat and was chased and eventually attacked by another male dugong or dugongs," Jatuporn Buruspat, director-general of the Department of Marine and Coastal Resources, told the AP. It seems that Marium died after being attacked by one or more males. Although the article mentions plastic in her intestines, nowhere does it say that the plastic was the cause of death. There is a good chance that a lot of the marine life invests plastic and we just notice it when we perform a necropsy after a death.
- romaaeterna 7y ago
  I think that it's a case of sup-par AP reporting. The Thai-language autopsy report is more clear. They found a bunch of plastic bags wadded together in the colon.
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
  - JohnJamesRambo 7y ago
    Ah that sounds more serious than the "found numerous tiny plastic pieces in her intestines" which had me doubting that was the cause of death.
- xiphias2 7y ago
  The more I hear about plastic pollution the more worried I am that it's working as a distraction for air pollution, global warming and problems of the global economy: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0308597X1830681X https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0308597X1...
  - esotericn 7y ago
    It's all an issue simultaneously.
kipqi 7y ago
Natural selection. The ecosystem is evolving; if you can't stop yourself from eating plastic you'll be wiped.
- thih9 7y ago
  Some species cannot stop eating plastic, other populations can but will still be seriously harmed. Keep in mind that humans introduced plastic and have control over its presence. Perhaps the term „ecosystem evolution” is too general in this case; ecosystem destruction might be more accurate. It’s up to us what is the next step. We can leave things up to natural selection, but do we want to?
laurex 7y ago
When I was in Vietnam earlier this year, I finally understood how much of a problem we have. The ocean water was totally clogged with plastic and trash. In North America, we are not seeing what a lot of the rest of the world is dealing with in terms of persistent waste, presumably because we have more land for landfills and money to move trash into them?
- foxyv 7y ago
  You can put a LOT of trash in a small space. The cost of landfills is usually measured in the cost to collect and transport garbage to the landfills. Also, once the landfill is full it is often still usable after the fact. Especially if it is managed properly. Add this to the fact that quarries are creating excellent places to consign garbage. The big problem is the cost of energy to move and bury the garbage. A lot of third world countries don't have extensive waste management networks like the USA.
mantap 7y ago
I consider all these articles about plastic pollution to be a kind of "fake news" because they are completely misleading people as to the nature of the problem. The plastic waste that is entering the oceans is because people in developing countries that lack waste management systems, dump their trash in rivers and it floats out to sea. The root cause is poverty and corrupt, ineffective governments. It's not a problem that can be resolved by western consumer action or even western legislation.
- apatters 7y ago
  Western governments absolutely can and do apply geopolitical pressure via measures like sanctions, tariffs and trade agreements. Now whether they have the will to do it over plastic waste (or carbon emissions or democratic governance or human rights) is another matter, because they have only a few tools and there are thousands of priorities competing for those tools. It also doesn't help with leverage when there is a powerful economic actor which doesn't require any of these terms as conditions of doing business: China.
  - stevenjohns 7y ago
    Alternatively, instead of starving countries to death[0], maybe Western countries should stop sending their trash to third world countries[1][2]. Perhaps it's not the fault of those poorer countries, but instead the fault of the Enlightened West (those that care about carbon emissions, democratic governance and human rights) illegally dumping their garbage onto other countries[3]? There's something funny about Western governments illegally dumping thousands of tonnes of trash on the shores of poor countries[4] and then people having the audacity to support sanctions - literally punishing the civilians there by starving them through siege - for not having the ability to properly manage the waste. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanctions_against_Iraq#Effects_on_the_Iraqi_people_during_sanctions https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanctions_against_Iraq#Effects... [1] https://www.dw.com/en/tired-of-being-trashed-philippines-ready-to-dump-garbage-in-canada/a-48829282 https://www.dw.com/en/tired-of-being-trashed-philippines-rea... [2] http://www.atchuup.com/countries-used-as-dumping-grounds-of-worlds-trash/ http://www.atchuup.com/countries-used-as-dumping-grounds-of-... [3] https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-05-29/malaysia-to-send-tonnes-of-plastic-waste-back-to-foreign-nations/11159208 https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-05-29/malaysia-to-send-tonn... [4] http://collections.unu.edu/eserv/UNU:6349/PiP_Report.pdf http://collections.unu.edu/eserv/UNU:6349/PiP_Report.pdf

91 points by laurex 7y ago

I'm doubtful that humanity will be able to resolve its plastics crisis without a radical, 'immediate' shift in how nations manufacture and consume product. No matter what great research or innovations exist or are on the horizon, we've long passed the point of no return and are entrenched in our habits. There's been a profusion of news illustrating how egregious our situation is and I'm always left wondering how the future is going to look like and in what new ways people are going to adapt.

mrnobody_67 7y ago

We need biodegradable plastic bottles now, and an outright ban on styrofoam....

Sawamara 7y ago
Biodegradability means nothing in the context of plastic that ends up in rivers, seas and oceans. Nothing. That is not a solution. We need waste control, enforced harsh laws on producers (industries and tourists and waste manager companies), and we needed it a decade ago. This is what happens when capitalism relies on an externality and that externality is fed up with its bullcrap.

pvaldes 7y ago

Moral of the history: Nothing can substitute mother's lessons about what to eat and what not. Orphans of species that need a long period of weaning and teaching have more probabilities of die young.

rexpop 7y ago
You think the moral has nothing to do with our deliberate industries?

jaggederest 7y ago

I think it's a decent bet that future generations will see our usage of plastic in the past few decades pretty similarly to the way we see the historical usage of asbestos during the middle part of the 20th century.

romaaeterna 7y ago
Agreed, but as a practical matter, we should be clear about where the vast majority of Ocean plastic comes from. https://i.imgur.com/D60ySOI.png https://i.imgur.com/D60ySOI.png
- contingencies 7y ago
  That data is suspect.
  - contingencies 7y ago
    Knowing there is no way those numbers are right I point out it's dodgy looking, get viciously downvoted (probably by some kind of yay US crowd who dislike people living in China having an opinion) but when the source is quoted has literally been corrected by its own authors.[0] Typical HN. [0] https://pubs.acs.org/doi/suppl/10.1021/acs.est.7b06377/suppl_file/es7b06377_si_002.pdf https://pubs.acs.org/doi/suppl/10.1021/acs.est.7b06377/suppl...
    - romaaeterna 7y ago
      I don't know what is "typical HN", but what you have linked to was only a correction in the table headings. They say in the correction notice that it "does not affect the data, only the table headings." They had switched "Model 1" and "Model 2" in the original. https://pubs.acs.org/doi/10.1021/acs.est.7b06377 https://pubs.acs.org/doi/10.1021/acs.est.7b06377
      - contingencies 7y ago
        OK. Actually the reason I felt it was unlikely to be correct was that I have lived in both river deltas (a year each in Shanghai, Shenzhen, Zhuhai) as well as travelled extensively (Suzhou, Yangzhou, upper Yangtse, Jiangmen, etc.) and suspect given the manufacturing and residential density and geographic expanse of the lower PRD, it should have significant garbage versus Yangtse. How was the data gathered? Satellite? When was it gathered? The 2017 paper probably uses 2015 or earlier data, there have been substantial improvements on environmental issues in the PRD region (really China-wide) of late, but I'd still be surprised if it's substantially cleaner in plastic refuse terms than the Yangtse.

RcouF1uZ4gsC 7y ago

>But last week, her caregivers found her listless and bruised, reports the AP. >In addition to Marium eating plastic, biologists believe she was pursued by an overly aggressive male during the mating season. >"We assume she wandered off too far from her natural habitat and was chased and eventually attacked by another male dugong or dugongs," Jatuporn Buruspat, director-general of the Department of Marine and Coastal Resources, told the AP. It seems that Marium died after being attacked by one or more males. Although the article mentions plastic in her intestines, nowhere does it say that the plastic was the cause of death. There is a good chance that a lot of the marine life invests plastic and we just notice it when we perform a necropsy after a death.

romaaeterna 7y ago
I think that it's a case of sup-par AP reporting. The Thai-language autopsy report is more clear. They found a bunch of plastic bags wadded together in the colon.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- JohnJamesRambo 7y ago
  Ah that sounds more serious than the "found numerous tiny plastic pieces in her intestines" which had me doubting that was the cause of death.
xiphias2 7y ago
The more I hear about plastic pollution the more worried I am that it's working as a distraction for air pollution, global warming and problems of the global economy: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0308597X1830681X https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0308597X1...
- esotericn 7y ago
  It's all an issue simultaneously.

kipqi 7y ago

Natural selection. The ecosystem is evolving; if you can't stop yourself from eating plastic you'll be wiped.

thih9 7y ago
Some species cannot stop eating plastic, other populations can but will still be seriously harmed. Keep in mind that humans introduced plastic and have control over its presence. Perhaps the term „ecosystem evolution” is too general in this case; ecosystem destruction might be more accurate. It’s up to us what is the next step. We can leave things up to natural selection, but do we want to?

laurex 7y ago

When I was in Vietnam earlier this year, I finally understood how much of a problem we have. The ocean water was totally clogged with plastic and trash. In North America, we are not seeing what a lot of the rest of the world is dealing with in terms of persistent waste, presumably because we have more land for landfills and money to move trash into them?

foxyv 7y ago
You can put a LOT of trash in a small space. The cost of landfills is usually measured in the cost to collect and transport garbage to the landfills. Also, once the landfill is full it is often still usable after the fact. Especially if it is managed properly. Add this to the fact that quarries are creating excellent places to consign garbage. The big problem is the cost of energy to move and bury the garbage. A lot of third world countries don't have extensive waste management networks like the USA.

mantap 7y ago

I consider all these articles about plastic pollution to be a kind of "fake news" because they are completely misleading people as to the nature of the problem. The plastic waste that is entering the oceans is because people in developing countries that lack waste management systems, dump their trash in rivers and it floats out to sea. The root cause is poverty and corrupt, ineffective governments. It's not a problem that can be resolved by western consumer action or even western legislation.

apatters 7y ago
Western governments absolutely can and do apply geopolitical pressure via measures like sanctions, tariffs and trade agreements. Now whether they have the will to do it over plastic waste (or carbon emissions or democratic governance or human rights) is another matter, because they have only a few tools and there are thousands of priorities competing for those tools. It also doesn't help with leverage when there is a powerful economic actor which doesn't require any of these terms as conditions of doing business: China.
- stevenjohns 7y ago
  Alternatively, instead of starving countries to death[0], maybe Western countries should stop sending their trash to third world countries[1][2]. Perhaps it's not the fault of those poorer countries, but instead the fault of the Enlightened West (those that care about carbon emissions, democratic governance and human rights) illegally dumping their garbage onto other countries[3]? There's something funny about Western governments illegally dumping thousands of tonnes of trash on the shores of poor countries[4] and then people having the audacity to support sanctions - literally punishing the civilians there by starving them through siege - for not having the ability to properly manage the waste. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanctions_against_Iraq#Effects_on_the_Iraqi_people_during_sanctions https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanctions_against_Iraq#Effects... [1] https://www.dw.com/en/tired-of-being-trashed-philippines-ready-to-dump-garbage-in-canada/a-48829282 https://www.dw.com/en/tired-of-being-trashed-philippines-rea... [2] http://www.atchuup.com/countries-used-as-dumping-grounds-of-worlds-trash/ http://www.atchuup.com/countries-used-as-dumping-grounds-of-... [3] https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-05-29/malaysia-to-send-tonnes-of-plastic-waste-back-to-foreign-nations/11159208 https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-05-29/malaysia-to-send-tonn... [4] http://collections.unu.edu/eserv/UNU:6349/PiP_Report.pdf http://collections.unu.edu/eserv/UNU:6349/PiP_Report.pdf