4 ms·

Well if you read the article, they say that the media should take these stories as opportunities to discuss pressing social issues instead of skating around the

by snek 7y ago

Well if you read the article, they say that the media should take these stories as opportunities to discuss pressing social issues instead of skating around them. Reporting is about bringing cohesive context to information, and these stories do the opposite.

whatshisface 7y ago
>Reporting is about bringing cohesive context to information Policy discussion is about bringing cohesive context to information. Reporting is about reporting information.
- ggggtez 7y ago
  Do you really think reporters just state facts and call it a day? How do they know which facts are the important ones to say? Why not list the shoesize of everyone they interview, along with the name of their dog? Obviously, I'm making a point: Facts tell a story. The reporters for these stories are choosing what facts tell the narrative they think people want (triumph over adversity) without mentioning the facts that they think people don't want (acknowledging that the healthcare system in the US is broken for most Americans).
  - whatshisface 7y ago
    There's a subtle difference between sorting based on priority and compiling facts to suit a narrative. If you start with a narrative, you will fall prey to things like confirmation bias. There's nothing wrong with prioritizing the most important information, but it's very bad to say "today I am going to prove that XYZ" before going around prioritizing all the facts that would make XYZ seem real. It's a fine line between journalism and opinion pieces. To get a better perspective of this, imagine a reporter that earnestly believed something you disagreed with. You'd probably want them to stick to the facts instead of tying every world event to their favorite policy.
- adamisom 7y ago
  "Some Home Depot workers built a walker". That's information. That is not (all) reporters do.
chrisseaton 7y ago
> Well if you read the article It’s against site guidelines here to accuse people of not reading the article - please don’t do this.
- sbhn 7y ago
  Your not supposed to talk about ‘not reading the article’, because HN doesn't want people to catch on that HN knows if you read the article. it’s a remarketing/cookie thing. HN knows what you did last summer.
- unreal37 7y ago
  But you're not arguing against the point made in the article but something else. So...
  - chrisseaton 7y ago
    I think I am - the article describes people trying to help as a 'reprehensible story treated as heroic'. The people trying to help can be heroic, even if they shouldn't have to help. Isn't that the situation for most people trying to help anyway? Ideally they wouldn't have to help. But they can still be heroic, not reprehensible.
    - kaitai 7y ago
      It seems to me you're confusing the grammar. The people are not reprehensible: reprehensible refers to the situation, instead. The situation in which two-year-olds are left without proper medical care and parents are left without any safety net is reprehensible. One should not paint the situation as wonderful when it is bad. Of course the people involved are simply trying their best, and trying to "make the best of a bad situation".
      - chrisseaton 7y ago
        But all situations that need help are reprehensible! Otherwise they wouldn't need help.
droithomme 7y ago
> they say that the media should take these stories as opportunities to discuss pressing social issues instead of skating around them That does happen sometimes and as a result the poor do-gooder that was just minding his own business and trying to help a family member or friend ends up being vilified and receiving threats. Even just saying hey here's a person that did a nice thing brings out haters. It gets much worse if the action is associated with a political viewpoint that significant numbers of people oppose for any reason. I would never ever ever want any of my good deeds to be highlighted in some media article. It would be no end of trouble. Don't talk to cops. Don't talk to reporters.
mlyle 7y ago
It's a fair complaint, but often is over-stretched to situations where it doesn't fit well. e.g. Those kids who came up with a creative solution for a disabled 2 year old to play and be entertained deserve to be commended. Yes, it's horrible there's a disabled two year old, but...
- goldcd 7y ago
  The point is that in most Western countries (US aside), the idea that the folks down the local hardware store made a medical device is simply bizarre. My NHS is most certainly not perfect, but provides a decent safety net. They'd have provided a walker, and maybe the local DIY store might build a playground for local kids in the park.
  - chrisseaton 7y ago
    > the idea that the folks down the local hardware store made a medical device is simply bizarre Well yeah it was bizarre enough in the US to be a news story as well.
    - goldcd 7y ago
      The point of the article is that "These DIY staffers built this handy contraption" - but also that the stories they reference seem to consider it entirely normal that if they hadn't this child would have been shit-out-of-luck. It's incredibly strange visiting/talking to Americans how many (of all backgrounds) have this aversion to "socialism" If somebody steals your wallet, you're fine with calling a Police force. If your house is on fire, you'll call the fire brigade. If somebody attacks your country, you'll invoke your military. If your child is sick, you'll dig out some insurance paper-work and see if you're covered for treatment - as god-forbid you could just consider "getting sick" something you might want resolved by your government as an acceptable use of your taxes. The normal pushback when I raise this is some weird idea that this would in some way force sub-standard treatment on all (tax can't pay for great treatment for everyone). This isn't the case. I have private healthcare insurance in the UK from my employer (like many of us do) - but it tends to be used for the little things. Sports-injury clinics, elective surgery at the time of our choosing etc. If anything serious happens to us - then the NHS is the preferred option (private healthcare doesn't even provide A&E, trauma etc). If your need is great, then you'll be triaged to the top of everything and get whatever you need.

by snek 7y ago

whatshisface 7y ago

>Reporting is about bringing cohesive context to information Policy discussion is about bringing cohesive context to information. Reporting is about reporting information.

ggggtez 7y ago
Do you really think reporters just state facts and call it a day? How do they know which facts are the important ones to say? Why not list the shoesize of everyone they interview, along with the name of their dog? Obviously, I'm making a point: Facts tell a story. The reporters for these stories are choosing what facts tell the narrative they think people want (triumph over adversity) without mentioning the facts that they think people don't want (acknowledging that the healthcare system in the US is broken for most Americans).
- whatshisface 7y ago
  There's a subtle difference between sorting based on priority and compiling facts to suit a narrative. If you start with a narrative, you will fall prey to things like confirmation bias. There's nothing wrong with prioritizing the most important information, but it's very bad to say "today I am going to prove that XYZ" before going around prioritizing all the facts that would make XYZ seem real. It's a fine line between journalism and opinion pieces. To get a better perspective of this, imagine a reporter that earnestly believed something you disagreed with. You'd probably want them to stick to the facts instead of tying every world event to their favorite policy.
adamisom 7y ago
"Some Home Depot workers built a walker". That's information. That is not (all) reporters do.

chrisseaton 7y ago

> Well if you read the article It’s against site guidelines here to accuse people of not reading the article - please don’t do this.

sbhn 7y ago
Your not supposed to talk about ‘not reading the article’, because HN doesn't want people to catch on that HN knows if you read the article. it’s a remarketing/cookie thing. HN knows what you did last summer.
unreal37 7y ago
But you're not arguing against the point made in the article but something else. So...
- chrisseaton 7y ago
  I think I am - the article describes people trying to help as a 'reprehensible story treated as heroic'. The people trying to help can be heroic, even if they shouldn't have to help. Isn't that the situation for most people trying to help anyway? Ideally they wouldn't have to help. But they can still be heroic, not reprehensible.
  - kaitai 7y ago
    It seems to me you're confusing the grammar. The people are not reprehensible: reprehensible refers to the situation, instead. The situation in which two-year-olds are left without proper medical care and parents are left without any safety net is reprehensible. One should not paint the situation as wonderful when it is bad. Of course the people involved are simply trying their best, and trying to "make the best of a bad situation".
    - chrisseaton 7y ago
      But all situations that need help are reprehensible! Otherwise they wouldn't need help.

droithomme 7y ago

> they say that the media should take these stories as opportunities to discuss pressing social issues instead of skating around them That does happen sometimes and as a result the poor do-gooder that was just minding his own business and trying to help a family member or friend ends up being vilified and receiving threats. Even just saying hey here's a person that did a nice thing brings out haters. It gets much worse if the action is associated with a political viewpoint that significant numbers of people oppose for any reason. I would never ever ever want any of my good deeds to be highlighted in some media article. It would be no end of trouble. Don't talk to cops. Don't talk to reporters.

mlyle 7y ago

It's a fair complaint, but often is over-stretched to situations where it doesn't fit well. e.g. Those kids who came up with a creative solution for a disabled 2 year old to play and be entertained deserve to be commended. Yes, it's horrible there's a disabled two year old, but...

goldcd 7y ago
The point is that in most Western countries (US aside), the idea that the folks down the local hardware store made a medical device is simply bizarre. My NHS is most certainly not perfect, but provides a decent safety net. They'd have provided a walker, and maybe the local DIY store might build a playground for local kids in the park.
- chrisseaton 7y ago
  > the idea that the folks down the local hardware store made a medical device is simply bizarre Well yeah it was bizarre enough in the US to be a news story as well.
  - goldcd 7y ago
    The point of the article is that "These DIY staffers built this handy contraption" - but also that the stories they reference seem to consider it entirely normal that if they hadn't this child would have been shit-out-of-luck. It's incredibly strange visiting/talking to Americans how many (of all backgrounds) have this aversion to "socialism" If somebody steals your wallet, you're fine with calling a Police force. If your house is on fire, you'll call the fire brigade. If somebody attacks your country, you'll invoke your military. If your child is sick, you'll dig out some insurance paper-work and see if you're covered for treatment - as god-forbid you could just consider "getting sick" something you might want resolved by your government as an acceptable use of your taxes. The normal pushback when I raise this is some weird idea that this would in some way force sub-standard treatment on all (tax can't pay for great treatment for everyone). This isn't the case. I have private healthcare insurance in the UK from my employer (like many of us do) - but it tends to be used for the little things. Sports-injury clinics, elective surgery at the time of our choosing etc. If anything serious happens to us - then the NHS is the preferred option (private healthcare doesn't even provide A&E, trauma etc). If your need is great, then you'll be triaged to the top of everything and get whatever you need.