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I've been pointing out for a while that animals that are fully capable of hunting and eating reindeer and moose are also fully capable of hunting and eating hum

I've been pointing out for a while that animals that are fully capable of hunting and eating reindeer and moose are also fully capable of hunting and eating humans. To which people answer that the wolf is afraid of humans. AFAIK this misses the point as the reason why wolves shun people is because they instinctively know we are going to hurt them. i expect more attacks on people unless action is taken to keep wolves scared of people. By that I don't necesarily mean kllling wolves but ratheruse pepper spray, elctro shock etc etc.

johnchristopher 7y ago
Not in and from Canada. Why would there be more attacks ?
- dmoy 7y ago
  Wolf populations are bouncing back significantly after decades of culling was dropping the population very low. At least in MN where I'm from. I assume Canada too.
  - wavefunction 7y ago
    There aren't very many historical examples of wolf attacks in North America even at much greater levels of population in the past.
    - dmoy 7y ago
      There wasn't much written history before people rolled through with guns. I guess when I said decades of culling I should have said centuries.
      - eitland 7y ago
        Also it seems to me modern scientists has this habit of declaring that wolves doesn't attack humans. This means any account of that can be dismissed as untrustworthy, meaning there are no trustworthy accounts of wolves attacking humans. At least this is my feeling here in Norway.
AdrianB1 7y ago
Electroshock to wolves is a very unrealistic idea, they are strong, fast and hunt in packs. Similar to pepper spray. Putting fear into wolves is not something you can do in a year and it does not last long, they are hunters for thousands of generations and some pepper spray will not change that overnight (or ever).
- logfromblammo 7y ago
  Wolves don't know what stun batons or pepper sprayers are. They do know what a rival pack is. Act like a bigger, stronger pack, and they will retreat to their own territory. Stay with the group. Be aware of situation and surroundings. Call for help. Coordinate the response using language. The Canadian human/dog pack has millions in it. It's just out of sight and downwind right now. A wolf will never be afraid of a lone human, in their own pack's territory, no matter how many weapons they may carry. It understands forward-facing eyes, large ears, and sharp incisors. It understands when you stare it down while your buddies move to flank it and cut off escape routes. They aren't afraid of humans, per se; they are afraid of better wolves. So to trigger that fear, you have to be the superior pack-hunting apex predator. You can't teach one wolf to fear one human. You have to teach the whole pack to respect our pack's territory.
juskrey 7y ago
Dogs are "friends" not because of training or scaring them, but because of thousands of years of relentless selection. You can't really domesticate an animal population without killing of those who resist domestication.
dfsegoat 7y ago
Recently listened to a hunting guide on a podcast talk about a run in with a group of wolves: They were somewhere in the Rockies and were being stalked by a pack. The alpha held their attention fixed, while several other wolves flanked them on both sides. They ended up having to take a shot at the alpha and that broke off their attack. Good luck using pepper spray in that scenario.
- eitland 7y ago
  Mark my use of the phrase "not necessarily" :-) I guess I'm collecting downvotes from the other side of what I'm used to. Normally in local debates people will immediately try to frame someone as "kill all wolves" the moment one points out wolves are dangerous so that phrase was a defense against that, but it goes the other way as well: By all means: do shoot if you are surrounded by a pack! And maybe electroshock won't work ever, in which case we'll need to come up with something else. My point is: Wolves are dangerous but saying so doesn't mean I'm saying we should kill all wolves.

johnchristopher 7y ago

Not in and from Canada. Why would there be more attacks ?

dmoy 7y ago
Wolf populations are bouncing back significantly after decades of culling was dropping the population very low. At least in MN where I'm from. I assume Canada too.
- wavefunction 7y ago
  There aren't very many historical examples of wolf attacks in North America even at much greater levels of population in the past.
  - dmoy 7y ago
    There wasn't much written history before people rolled through with guns. I guess when I said decades of culling I should have said centuries.
    - eitland 7y ago
      Also it seems to me modern scientists has this habit of declaring that wolves doesn't attack humans. This means any account of that can be dismissed as untrustworthy, meaning there are no trustworthy accounts of wolves attacking humans. At least this is my feeling here in Norway.

AdrianB1 7y ago

Electroshock to wolves is a very unrealistic idea, they are strong, fast and hunt in packs. Similar to pepper spray. Putting fear into wolves is not something you can do in a year and it does not last long, they are hunters for thousands of generations and some pepper spray will not change that overnight (or ever).

logfromblammo 7y ago
Wolves don't know what stun batons or pepper sprayers are. They do know what a rival pack is. Act like a bigger, stronger pack, and they will retreat to their own territory. Stay with the group. Be aware of situation and surroundings. Call for help. Coordinate the response using language. The Canadian human/dog pack has millions in it. It's just out of sight and downwind right now. A wolf will never be afraid of a lone human, in their own pack's territory, no matter how many weapons they may carry. It understands forward-facing eyes, large ears, and sharp incisors. It understands when you stare it down while your buddies move to flank it and cut off escape routes. They aren't afraid of humans, per se; they are afraid of better wolves. So to trigger that fear, you have to be the superior pack-hunting apex predator. You can't teach one wolf to fear one human. You have to teach the whole pack to respect our pack's territory.

juskrey 7y ago

Dogs are "friends" not because of training or scaring them, but because of thousands of years of relentless selection. You can't really domesticate an animal population without killing of those who resist domestication.

dfsegoat 7y ago

Recently listened to a hunting guide on a podcast talk about a run in with a group of wolves: They were somewhere in the Rockies and were being stalked by a pack. The alpha held their attention fixed, while several other wolves flanked them on both sides. They ended up having to take a shot at the alpha and that broke off their attack. Good luck using pepper spray in that scenario.

eitland 7y ago
Mark my use of the phrase "not necessarily" :-) I guess I'm collecting downvotes from the other side of what I'm used to. Normally in local debates people will immediately try to frame someone as "kill all wolves" the moment one points out wolves are dangerous so that phrase was a defense against that, but it goes the other way as well: By all means: do shoot if you are surrounded by a pack! And maybe electroshock won't work ever, in which case we'll need to come up with something else. My point is: Wolves are dangerous but saying so doesn't mean I'm saying we should kill all wolves.