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Plus their infrastructure lead is literally gargantuan. Charging stations are everywhere, without them you might as well not have roads they can drive on.

Sohcahtoa82 7y ago
I must be missing something because I'm not sure why this matters when Tesla has made their patents open. Can't someone else make a car that can use a Tesla supercharger? Why wouldn't another manufacturer make their cars compatible with Tesla's charging network, then sell that as a massive feature?
- gergles 7y ago
  Tesla's network is not open-access, there is authentication involved so that even if you implement the physical standard you can't use their chargers without their consent.
- zaroth 7y ago
  Tesla has indeed offered to share the Supercharger network, with anyone who is also willing to split the cost. You cannot just plug in and get charge with the right adaptor. You need to be authorized by the billing software to get juice. This happens automatically when you plug in a Tesla to the charger.
  - clouddrover 7y ago
    > Tesla has indeed offered to share the Supercharger network Tesla should standardize on CCS like everyone else has and enter into billing agreements with the other charging networks. That's what Electrify America and ChargePoint have done: https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/electrify-america-chargepoint-roaming-partnership/ https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/electrify-america-chargep...
  - Sohcahtoa82 7y ago
    I figured there'd be a billing issue to sort out, and that Tesla might even charge a non-Tesla a little more to use their chargers, and maybe other manufacturers really don't like the idea of giving their competition money, but...c'mon. Certainly you could sell a lot more cars if you advertised being able to use Tesla's network, even if you had to pay a small premium to use it.
    - zaroth 7y ago
      I believe the offer is any car maker who wants to use it has to pay for half of the whole infrastructure / build out cost for the network. No way someone can come in and use the network and just pay the cost of electricity, or even a premium on the electricity. Tesla is going to want someone to share the cost of building it out. Of course since they sell way more EVs by quantity, it would benefit them more than anyone who might come and offer to split the cost. Which is why no one will take them up on it until they can see a way to selling 6 digit quantities of EVs.
ddoolin 7y ago
Yeah...I will not miss their infrastructure at all. If you live in a moderately-populated area (anywhere on the west coast), the stations have been laughable. They're overcrowded and many stalls are VERY OFTEN broken. I may wait up to 30 minutes in line and sometimes up to a quarter of the stalls are either outright broken or trickle-charge. Not to mention the complete lack of a proper queue system leading to disagreements every single time about who was there first, etc. If you own a home, this is probably a non-issue. For the rest of us (which is most of us, at least in California), good luck. FWIW, when I first purchased I was one Tesla of a handful in the entire city (east coast). Moving here, I am one in a handful in every square mile. I just ditched my Model S after 3 years and I feel great about it. I absolutely won't miss the charging, but I also won't miss the laughably barebones interior, litany of software bugs, or unjustifiably high price tag, either. The driving however, I absolutely will miss, but there's much more to the experience than that with a fully-electric.
- SimbaOnSteroids 7y ago
  Their infrastructure may be laughable when compared to the experience that we've grown accustomed to as people raised with gas stations everywhere. However it _does_actually_exist_. Which isn't exactly something you can say for the offerings of say Nissan or Chevy. I'd also imagine that if your experience with their charging network was that frustrating it makes you an atypical user; as I can only assume the bulk of people drive their commute everyday, and that's about it, maybe pick up the kids, maybe run a few errands, but not running 200+ miles per day. Meaning you get to charge at night. I'm not surprised about the bugs, the bugs that are in my parents' Priuses (Prii?) are obnoxious to say the least, and Teslas software is many times more complicated. When you say barebones you mean like lack of cup holders or arm rests, etc? Or just the lack of _stuff_, in much the same way a room painted white feels empty?

Sohcahtoa82 7y ago

I must be missing something because I'm not sure why this matters when Tesla has made their patents open. Can't someone else make a car that can use a Tesla supercharger? Why wouldn't another manufacturer make their cars compatible with Tesla's charging network, then sell that as a massive feature?

gergles 7y ago
Tesla's network is not open-access, there is authentication involved so that even if you implement the physical standard you can't use their chargers without their consent.
zaroth 7y ago
Tesla has indeed offered to share the Supercharger network, with anyone who is also willing to split the cost. You cannot just plug in and get charge with the right adaptor. You need to be authorized by the billing software to get juice. This happens automatically when you plug in a Tesla to the charger.
- clouddrover 7y ago
  > Tesla has indeed offered to share the Supercharger network Tesla should standardize on CCS like everyone else has and enter into billing agreements with the other charging networks. That's what Electrify America and ChargePoint have done: https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/electrify-america-chargepoint-roaming-partnership/ https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/electrify-america-chargep...
- Sohcahtoa82 7y ago
  I figured there'd be a billing issue to sort out, and that Tesla might even charge a non-Tesla a little more to use their chargers, and maybe other manufacturers really don't like the idea of giving their competition money, but...c'mon. Certainly you could sell a lot more cars if you advertised being able to use Tesla's network, even if you had to pay a small premium to use it.
  - zaroth 7y ago
    I believe the offer is any car maker who wants to use it has to pay for half of the whole infrastructure / build out cost for the network. No way someone can come in and use the network and just pay the cost of electricity, or even a premium on the electricity. Tesla is going to want someone to share the cost of building it out. Of course since they sell way more EVs by quantity, it would benefit them more than anyone who might come and offer to split the cost. Which is why no one will take them up on it until they can see a way to selling 6 digit quantities of EVs.

ddoolin 7y ago

Yeah...I will not miss their infrastructure at all. If you live in a moderately-populated area (anywhere on the west coast), the stations have been laughable. They're overcrowded and many stalls are VERY OFTEN broken. I may wait up to 30 minutes in line and sometimes up to a quarter of the stalls are either outright broken or trickle-charge. Not to mention the complete lack of a proper queue system leading to disagreements every single time about who was there first, etc. If you own a home, this is probably a non-issue. For the rest of us (which is most of us, at least in California), good luck. FWIW, when I first purchased I was one Tesla of a handful in the entire city (east coast). Moving here, I am one in a handful in every square mile. I just ditched my Model S after 3 years and I feel great about it. I absolutely won't miss the charging, but I also won't miss the laughably barebones interior, litany of software bugs, or unjustifiably high price tag, either. The driving however, I absolutely will miss, but there's much more to the experience than that with a fully-electric.

SimbaOnSteroids 7y ago
Their infrastructure may be laughable when compared to the experience that we've grown accustomed to as people raised with gas stations everywhere. However it _does_actually_exist_. Which isn't exactly something you can say for the offerings of say Nissan or Chevy. I'd also imagine that if your experience with their charging network was that frustrating it makes you an atypical user; as I can only assume the bulk of people drive their commute everyday, and that's about it, maybe pick up the kids, maybe run a few errands, but not running 200+ miles per day. Meaning you get to charge at night. I'm not surprised about the bugs, the bugs that are in my parents' Priuses (Prii?) are obnoxious to say the least, and Teslas software is many times more complicated. When you say barebones you mean like lack of cup holders or arm rests, etc? Or just the lack of _stuff_, in much the same way a room painted white feels empty?