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Oh dear... * earthquakes and the like _shift locations_ on the crust. The "w3w" address you had for your house isn't at that "w3w" address anymore since that l

Oh dear... * earthquakes and the like _shift locations_ on the crust. The "w3w" address you had for your house isn't at that "w3w" address anymore since that last big quake. Reprint stationery? * no translation between the English w3w and the Spanish, French, Italian, what-have-you. They're different words altogether. No back and forth. * It's not open * if one needs a DATA CONNECTION to find out their current w3w address, they can damn well find the GPS coordinates, too. As a bonus, they don't need a data connection to do that... See also: https://shkspr.mobi/blog/2019/03/why-bother-with-what-three-words/ https://shkspr.mobi/blog/2019/03/why-bother-with-what-three-...

vinay427 7y ago
Also, it's not hierarchical with most and least significant words, so changing any of the words would send you some indefinite distance from where you're trying to go. Open Location Codes (in Google Maps, for instance) seem to solve all of these problems except for not having arguably memorable words. It also doesn't change in line with earthquakes or other shifts, though I would argue that's a benefit more than a drawback. You can even omit the first few most significant digits by listing the municipality (where those exist) making it somewhat compatible with existing political divisions. In places with poor addressing, I regularly have to send Google Maps location links, and this provides an open alternative that can be easily transferred onto paper or spoken through a telephone.
- Piskvorrr 7y ago
  That's a feature, IMNSHO. "I'm in the general vicinity of Wherever, Midsommer, UK, my code is horse.battery.staple" checks out, whereas "battery.horse.staple" is supposed to be halfway around the world, and thus unlikely to get confused.
  - vinay427 7y ago
    I suppose it depends on the specific application. If I were talking to emergency responders and they happened to mishear part of the message, I'd much prefer the chance that they have an idea of my vicinity than having a likely infeasible number of possible word combinations, a few of which might provide reasonable locations if it were possible to check them all. In other words, your example would hold true if they heard and remembered the three words correctly in the wrong order, but that's not a gamble I'd want to take particularly if the API to check codes is restricted.
    - Piskvorrr 7y ago
      Sure, there are other concerns here.; the "unhash impossible" being the largest.
      - vinay427 7y ago
        Yep, and I didn't make this clear in my previous reply but I think your example would actually prove very useful for specific applications. Just not for the uses I was imagining in my head, I guess... :)
Piskvorrr 7y ago
That move "let's have a disparate set of dictionaries that don't map to each other" is especially confusing.
silvester23 7y ago
> * if one needs a DATA CONNECTION to find out their current w3w address, they can damn well find the GPS coordinates Not arguing your other points (in fact, I agree), but if you have the app installed on your phone, you do not need a data connection to find your current w3w address.
- kingosticks 7y ago
  It's also a lot easier to remember (and verbally communicate) 3 words than long/latitude. If I'd just legged it down a mountain to tell the police where my injured friends are I'd have a low chance recalling the numbers (assuming I wasn't able to write it down for some reason).
  - pgeorgi 7y ago
    You have some device complex enough to tell you the words, surely it can store them. Same for OLC or any other scheme more complex than Lat/Long (and even then it's not the early 90s anymore).
    - kingosticks 7y ago
      True. But who knows why I can't store the data in this abnormal emergency situation. Maybe I left the only working device with my friends. It doesn't really matter, 3 English words are still easier to remember and communicate than codes.
dtf 7y ago
I agree with these points, and yet: "Humberside Police also used the system to find a group of foreign nationals, including a pregnant woman in labour, who were trapped inside a shipping container at a port. The port had over 20,000 containers and we knew that we needed to get to them quickly," said the force's control room supervisor Paul Redshaw. The group were told to download the app and they were soon found. There is no doubt in my mind that these incidents could have had very different outcomes had we not been able to use what3words," Mr Redshaw said." The emergency services see something very useful here. Is there a better way to do it? Lat/Lon numbers just don't cut it.
- Piskvorrr 7y ago
  If that's an actual story and not PR. What I see: a full-metal enclosure AKA shipping container, and yet a GPS fix is obtained? Pull the other one.
  - taneq 7y ago
    Hell, I struggle to even get a cell signal inside one of those things.
- sho 7y ago
  I have a lot of trouble believing that story.
  - dtf 7y ago
    The quote is from a serving member of police staff. Should be easy to verify. https://twitter.com/redshaw27 https://twitter.com/redshaw27 There are further cases mentioned in the article from other police forces. - South Yorkshire Police used it to find a 65-year-old man who became trapped after falling down a railway embankment in Sheffield. - North Yorkshire Fire and Rescue Service found a woman who had crashed her car but was unsure where she was. - Humberside Police were able to quickly resolve a hostage situation after the victim was able to tell officers exactly where she was being held. If these are all completely made up, and have made it past the BBC, then I'm rather surprised. EDIT: I think this must be the incident: https://www.hulldailymail.co.uk/news/hull-east-yorkshire-news/11-migrants-found-container-police-2621681 https://www.hulldailymail.co.uk/news/hull-east-yorkshire-new... (The report mentions a substantial search, and in particular commends the actions of good doggo PD Logan: https://twitter.com/HPDogSection/status/1103713458334416896 https://twitter.com/HPDogSection/status/1103713458334416896)
eythian 7y ago
* earthquakes shifting you a meter or so are a really big deal, reprinting stationery would be low on the scale of things you're caring about. * translations so often don't work in a one-to-one fashion, it'd be risky to expect them to do so. * this is a big deal. * had you read the article, it specifically explains that you don't need a data connection to determine the address. Also, GPS coordinates are a terrible way to pass locations between humans, numbers are easy to transpose, mess up, forget.
- Piskvorrr 7y ago
  Re translations: Sure. But is the expectation "I'm passing a set of words, of course it doesn't translate", or "I'm passing a location, of course it's the same location regardless of language"? (IDK)
- furi 7y ago
  > translations so often don't work in a one-to-one fashion, it'd be risky to expect them to do so. That's hardly a point in What3Words' favor. They dragged words into it where previously there were only numbers so now they're responsible for finding a solution to the problem of words' cultural specificity. I don't think "our coordinates contain zero information that crosses linguistic boundaries" is a good solution to that problem.
deleted 7y ago
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vinay427 7y ago

Also, it's not hierarchical with most and least significant words, so changing any of the words would send you some indefinite distance from where you're trying to go. Open Location Codes (in Google Maps, for instance) seem to solve all of these problems except for not having arguably memorable words. It also doesn't change in line with earthquakes or other shifts, though I would argue that's a benefit more than a drawback. You can even omit the first few most significant digits by listing the municipality (where those exist) making it somewhat compatible with existing political divisions. In places with poor addressing, I regularly have to send Google Maps location links, and this provides an open alternative that can be easily transferred onto paper or spoken through a telephone.

Piskvorrr 7y ago
That's a feature, IMNSHO. "I'm in the general vicinity of Wherever, Midsommer, UK, my code is horse.battery.staple" checks out, whereas "battery.horse.staple" is supposed to be halfway around the world, and thus unlikely to get confused.
- vinay427 7y ago
  I suppose it depends on the specific application. If I were talking to emergency responders and they happened to mishear part of the message, I'd much prefer the chance that they have an idea of my vicinity than having a likely infeasible number of possible word combinations, a few of which might provide reasonable locations if it were possible to check them all. In other words, your example would hold true if they heard and remembered the three words correctly in the wrong order, but that's not a gamble I'd want to take particularly if the API to check codes is restricted.
  - Piskvorrr 7y ago
    Sure, there are other concerns here.; the "unhash impossible" being the largest.
    - vinay427 7y ago
      Yep, and I didn't make this clear in my previous reply but I think your example would actually prove very useful for specific applications. Just not for the uses I was imagining in my head, I guess... :)

Piskvorrr 7y ago

That move "let's have a disparate set of dictionaries that don't map to each other" is especially confusing.

silvester23 7y ago

> * if one needs a DATA CONNECTION to find out their current w3w address, they can damn well find the GPS coordinates Not arguing your other points (in fact, I agree), but if you have the app installed on your phone, you do not need a data connection to find your current w3w address.

kingosticks 7y ago
It's also a lot easier to remember (and verbally communicate) 3 words than long/latitude. If I'd just legged it down a mountain to tell the police where my injured friends are I'd have a low chance recalling the numbers (assuming I wasn't able to write it down for some reason).
- pgeorgi 7y ago
  You have some device complex enough to tell you the words, surely it can store them. Same for OLC or any other scheme more complex than Lat/Long (and even then it's not the early 90s anymore).
  - kingosticks 7y ago
    True. But who knows why I can't store the data in this abnormal emergency situation. Maybe I left the only working device with my friends. It doesn't really matter, 3 English words are still easier to remember and communicate than codes.

dtf 7y ago

I agree with these points, and yet: "Humberside Police also used the system to find a group of foreign nationals, including a pregnant woman in labour, who were trapped inside a shipping container at a port. The port had over 20,000 containers and we knew that we needed to get to them quickly," said the force's control room supervisor Paul Redshaw. The group were told to download the app and they were soon found. There is no doubt in my mind that these incidents could have had very different outcomes had we not been able to use what3words," Mr Redshaw said." The emergency services see something very useful here. Is there a better way to do it? Lat/Lon numbers just don't cut it.

Piskvorrr 7y ago
If that's an actual story and not PR. What I see: a full-metal enclosure AKA shipping container, and yet a GPS fix is obtained? Pull the other one.
- taneq 7y ago
  Hell, I struggle to even get a cell signal inside one of those things.
sho 7y ago
I have a lot of trouble believing that story.
- dtf 7y ago
  The quote is from a serving member of police staff. Should be easy to verify. https://twitter.com/redshaw27 https://twitter.com/redshaw27 There are further cases mentioned in the article from other police forces. - South Yorkshire Police used it to find a 65-year-old man who became trapped after falling down a railway embankment in Sheffield. - North Yorkshire Fire and Rescue Service found a woman who had crashed her car but was unsure where she was. - Humberside Police were able to quickly resolve a hostage situation after the victim was able to tell officers exactly where she was being held. If these are all completely made up, and have made it past the BBC, then I'm rather surprised. EDIT: I think this must be the incident: https://www.hulldailymail.co.uk/news/hull-east-yorkshire-news/11-migrants-found-container-police-2621681 https://www.hulldailymail.co.uk/news/hull-east-yorkshire-new... (The report mentions a substantial search, and in particular commends the actions of good doggo PD Logan: https://twitter.com/HPDogSection/status/1103713458334416896 https://twitter.com/HPDogSection/status/1103713458334416896)

eythian 7y ago

* earthquakes shifting you a meter or so are a really big deal, reprinting stationery would be low on the scale of things you're caring about. * translations so often don't work in a one-to-one fashion, it'd be risky to expect them to do so. * this is a big deal. * had you read the article, it specifically explains that you don't need a data connection to determine the address. Also, GPS coordinates are a terrible way to pass locations between humans, numbers are easy to transpose, mess up, forget.

Piskvorrr 7y ago
Re translations: Sure. But is the expectation "I'm passing a set of words, of course it doesn't translate", or "I'm passing a location, of course it's the same location regardless of language"? (IDK)
furi 7y ago
> translations so often don't work in a one-to-one fashion, it'd be risky to expect them to do so. That's hardly a point in What3Words' favor. They dragged words into it where previously there were only numbers so now they're responsible for finding a solution to the problem of words' cultural specificity. I don't think "our coordinates contain zero information that crosses linguistic boundaries" is a good solution to that problem.

deleted 7y ago

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