6 ms·

To the contrary, of all the cognitive capabilities that evolution has bestowed on us, I think language is clearly the highest.

Retric 7y ago
Defining your own scale is fine. But, don’t be confused when you are the only one using it. High vs low level tasks are defined in terms of what you can do while doing the task. You can be thinking about a math problem for example while talking with someone.
- mannykannot 7y ago
  I will agree that tasks like parsing sounds and forming words are low-level tasks, but my original post was about understanding the meaning of language, and it is not just in my own private lexicon that this is regarded as a higher cognitive process, as a brief search will reveal (e.g. [1].) With regard to your ranking test, is it talking with someone or thinking about a math problem that gets ranked as low-level? It would seem to work either way, in which case, I guess it would be both. [1] https://www.thefreedictionary.com/higher+cognitive+process https://www.thefreedictionary.com/higher+cognitive+process
  - Retric 7y ago
    Medicine, psychology, and neuroscience all have different definitions of this stuff. understanding the meaning of language Understanding is vague in these terms. You can notice someone calling your name while distracted with other activities. That’s an automatic process and assigning meaning for each word in English is a difficult task. How do you teach a computer what cells are in the abstract? There is also some high level language decoding where people extract meaning from poetry etc. But, we need to get the low level task done first. PS: As to ranking, their are a lot of high level tasks you can’t do at the same time. Often described as things that take concentration, but few language tasks make this list.
    - mannykannot 7y ago
      > Medicine, psychology, and neuroscience all have different definitions of this stuff. Well, maybe, but is it conventional usage in any of those fields to call the cognitive processes involved in producing and understanding linguistic communication low-level? Regardless, my ranking it high-level is not just my private usage, as you claimed. In fact, I would guess that it is a more conventional ranking than the one that seems to be implied by your method. > How do you teach a computer what cells are in the abstract? Well, precisely, it's at a higher level of abstraction than just picking out the word (I am pretty sure that's a conventional usage of 'higher'.) >There is also some high level language decoding where people extract meaning from poetry, etc. Poetry may be particularly obtuse, but that does not make all other meaning-extraction low-level. A lot of it, IMHO, belongs in that 'etc.' PS to your PS: There are also concentration-demanding motor skills. And the point about your ranking method is that it seems to put thinking about a math problem at the same level as talking with someone, which you are claiming is low-level.
      - Retric 7y ago
        > thinking about a math problem at the same level as talking with someone Plenty of people can hold a simple conversation while doing differential equations. As the conversation’s complexity increases that stops being the case. There is clearly a difference when talking to a distracted person. But, decoding “Do you want a soda?” and responding appropriately seems to require little if any attention. Neuroscience gives support of this in terms of what parts of the brain are involved in different aspects of language.
        mannykannot 7y ago
        I am interested as to whether you consider doing differential equations a simple task, here? Presumably so, as your method puts it on a par with simple conversations.
        Retric 7y ago
        No, you can’t do multiple high level tasks at the same time. Low level automatic tasks like breathing and balance fine to do at the same time. Being able to do differential equations and simple conversations but not complex conversations means simple conversations are lower level. Thus, it’s not language that makes complex conversations a high level task.

Retric 7y ago

Defining your own scale is fine. But, don’t be confused when you are the only one using it. High vs low level tasks are defined in terms of what you can do while doing the task. You can be thinking about a math problem for example while talking with someone.

mannykannot 7y ago
I will agree that tasks like parsing sounds and forming words are low-level tasks, but my original post was about understanding the meaning of language, and it is not just in my own private lexicon that this is regarded as a higher cognitive process, as a brief search will reveal (e.g. [1].) With regard to your ranking test, is it talking with someone or thinking about a math problem that gets ranked as low-level? It would seem to work either way, in which case, I guess it would be both. [1] https://www.thefreedictionary.com/higher+cognitive+process https://www.thefreedictionary.com/higher+cognitive+process
- Retric 7y ago
  Medicine, psychology, and neuroscience all have different definitions of this stuff. understanding the meaning of language Understanding is vague in these terms. You can notice someone calling your name while distracted with other activities. That’s an automatic process and assigning meaning for each word in English is a difficult task. How do you teach a computer what cells are in the abstract? There is also some high level language decoding where people extract meaning from poetry etc. But, we need to get the low level task done first. PS: As to ranking, their are a lot of high level tasks you can’t do at the same time. Often described as things that take concentration, but few language tasks make this list.
  - mannykannot 7y ago
    > Medicine, psychology, and neuroscience all have different definitions of this stuff. Well, maybe, but is it conventional usage in any of those fields to call the cognitive processes involved in producing and understanding linguistic communication low-level? Regardless, my ranking it high-level is not just my private usage, as you claimed. In fact, I would guess that it is a more conventional ranking than the one that seems to be implied by your method. > How do you teach a computer what cells are in the abstract? Well, precisely, it's at a higher level of abstraction than just picking out the word (I am pretty sure that's a conventional usage of 'higher'.) >There is also some high level language decoding where people extract meaning from poetry, etc. Poetry may be particularly obtuse, but that does not make all other meaning-extraction low-level. A lot of it, IMHO, belongs in that 'etc.' PS to your PS: There are also concentration-demanding motor skills. And the point about your ranking method is that it seems to put thinking about a math problem at the same level as talking with someone, which you are claiming is low-level.
    - Retric 7y ago
      > thinking about a math problem at the same level as talking with someone Plenty of people can hold a simple conversation while doing differential equations. As the conversation’s complexity increases that stops being the case. There is clearly a difference when talking to a distracted person. But, decoding “Do you want a soda?” and responding appropriately seems to require little if any attention. Neuroscience gives support of this in terms of what parts of the brain are involved in different aspects of language.
      - mannykannot 7y ago
        I am interested as to whether you consider doing differential equations a simple task, here? Presumably so, as your method puts it on a par with simple conversations.
        Retric 7y ago
        No, you can’t do multiple high level tasks at the same time. Low level automatic tasks like breathing and balance fine to do at the same time. Being able to do differential equations and simple conversations but not complex conversations means simple conversations are lower level. Thus, it’s not language that makes complex conversations a high level task.