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Doc Martens’s vegan boot business is thriving
- codemac 7y agoAlso note that Doc Marten's are reasonably priced compared to many Vegan shoe/boot leather alternatives that are socially acceptable. If you have $500 to spend on boots, it's probably easy enough to find whatever you want. If you have $100-$200, doc martens pull away quickly for the vegan crowd.
- cannonedhamster 7y agoYeah there's a lot of garbage vegan clothing out there. Good shoes typically set you back a few hundred unless you can get them on sale. Novacas is a great brand but you can only find them at resellers really Mooshoes has a pretty good selection but they are definitely going to be higher end shoes. Totally I find myself looking for the all man made materials on the label
- demygale 7y agoWills Vegan Shoes is good, but not inexpensive.
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- sarcher 7y agoI looked at Doc Martens a long time ago (a decade+) when I was looking for steel-toe non-leather work boots, but none of the vegan Doc Martens boots have steel/composite toe protection. I just checked again, and I think that's still the case. I've been rocking Bogs Turf Stompers for the last five years or so, but they've been discontinued I think (at least the steel toe version has been). Anyone else have good luck with non-leather steel/composite toe lace up workboots?
- ebg13 7y agoDo they have to be boot style? My favorite steel toes were slip-on shoes. Way more comfortable. Timberland has several safety shoe models with canvas or synthetic uppers.
- sarcher 7y agoI'll check Timberland, thanks!
- ht_th 7y ago> Anyone else have good luck with non-leather steel/composite toe lace up workboots? As an alternative: I like to wear wooden clogs whenever I am working outside or doing some heavy lifting or other stuff around the house that might hurt my feet.
- sarcher 7y agoUnfortunately, it's job-site PPE policy - I work in construction.
- rebuilder 7y agoI had Vegetarian Shoes boots once, wore them almost daily for 10 years. Solid boots. At the time, they had Doc Martens as well, I was under the impression they had licensed the brand and model. Here https://www.vegetarian-shoes.co.uk/unisex/airseal_10_eye_boot_smooth_black/17955_p.html https://www.vegetarian-shoes.co.uk/unisex/airseal_10_eye_boo...
- wUabkSG6L5Bfa5 7y agoWearing them as I type, have been for at least 10 years, will likely wear them til I die.
- arbuge 7y agoMeanwhile it appears that leather is piling up unused: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2019-08-09/america-s-obsession-with-beef-is-killing-the-leather-industry https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2019-08-09/america-s... The cows are still being slaughtered for their beef, which appears to be profitable enough for the practice to carry on even if the leather hides are now just dumped on landfills: "Cattle hides, an obligatory byproduct of beef and dairy consumption, will be around as long as Americans like cheeseburgers, steaks and ice cream. And while dairy producers have been under pressure from declining milk demand and dairy alternatives, the rise of meat substitutes has yet to dent America’s taste for the real thing." The implication would seem to be that products like these boots might have less environmental benefits than one might think.
- jszymborski 7y agoIt's a difficult calculus... On one hand, the hope is that you're making the margins slimmer on animal products. On the other hand, as you mentioned, you're buying new (often petroleum-based) materials versus (arguably more renewable) repurposed material.
- wUabkSG6L5Bfa5 7y agoThis. Part of the benefit is that it raises the cost of producing meat. Mass animal cruelty will be ended mostly by economics.
- whenchamenia 7y agoFarming is not animal cruelty.
- diablerouge 7y agoNo one is talking about farming. We're talking about factory meat production and slaughterhouses.
- kibwen 7y ago
- galago 7y agoSynthetic materials also make automation easier. I wonder if leather handling is one of the most expensive parts of shoe manufacturing. I've suspected that's why Nike (and probably other companies as well) seem to have fewer and fewer shoes with leather components.
- saidajigumi 7y agoThere's another facet to this. Some athletic shoes have recently started using advanced "3D" knitting machines for the uppers. With traditional shoe making, there's waste when cutting the components of the upper from a sheet of material. But a knitted upper has essentially zero waste material, because it's created to the precise target shape. I.e. it's an additive manufacturing process like a 3D printer rather than a subtractive process.
- devoply 7y agoPleather has been around forever, as an inferior product that does not last nearly as long. Let's call it vegan for a win. also: https://www.vocativ.com/281599/vegan-leather-isnt-as-ethical-as-you-think/ https://www.vocativ.com/281599/vegan-leather-isnt-as-ethical...
- ppseafield 7y agoRe: your link, I agree that we would do well to find better ways to produce non-animal-sourced clothing that doesn't produce the number of pollutants some of our current options do. But I take issue with this quote: > The holy grail of sustainability is a closed-loop system. “With leather, nature has created its own sort of closed-loop system,” says Hustvedt. “The carcass of an animal can decay in the ground and nurture plants that are eaten by the next generation of animal.” Yes, and that's great for the environment if you look past all of the environmental harm created by raising the animals needed for that leather. But CO2 and methane production, deforestation, runoff from factory farms... all of these consequences take a serious toll on the environment. There are a lot of bad choices for clothing - cotton is notorious for requiring a lot of pesticides to grow as well. And that many clothes are made in sweatshops in poorer countries, not uncommonly made with child labor. And it's all shipped across the ocean using fossil fuels. It doesn't have to be this way though.
- beatgammit 7y agoThe question is, are these animals being grown for food or leather? Afaik, leather is mostly a byproduct of the beef industry, and if it's not used it'll just go to waste. I could maybe agree that buying leather is a bad net choice if beef was the byproduct, but until I see that, I have no qualms about buying leather products, especially since they last longer than synthetic versions.
- ppseafield 7y agoEven if 0% of livestock was raised specifically for their hides, we have to globally reduce our animal consumption to stave off climate change as much as possible. It's not just a simple "Oh, it's a byproduct." It's a byproduct of an industry that is seriously contributing to climate change. And market interest in non-leather clothing will drive companies to make better non-leather clothing.
- rootusrootus 7y agoWas it Tesla that started this trend? Re-branding pleather as "vegan leather" is brilliant marketing.
- ticmasta 7y agono kidding - anyone truly surprised that their plastic boots sold at a vegan premium are very profitable?
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- gwbas1c 7y agoWhen I bought my Docs in 2015 they offered Vegan Leather. Not sure if Tesla used the term then.
- rootusrootus 7y agoI am not sure when Tesla began offering something with that brand. It seems like the term started gaining traction in about 2013 when some people in the fashion industry started describing pleather clothes as vegan leather.
- rory096 7y agoSeems to have started to really take off in late 2012: https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=US&q=%22vegan%20leather%22 https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=US&q=%... Might be a result of Free People launching a line with that term in July 2011: https://blog.freepeople.com/2011/07/vegan-leather-fp-debut/ https://blog.freepeople.com/2011/07/vegan-leather-fp-debut/ Some earlier examples include Matt & Nat ca. 2008: https://www.kqed.org/bayareabites/27914/vegan-fashion https://www.kqed.org/bayareabites/27914/vegan-fashion
- olivermarks 7y agoI have a pair of 1980's made in UK leather Doc Martens that I just recently realized are valuable. They've been made in China since 2002 and the quality isn't great. I'd be wary of 'vegan' meaning el cheapo uppers materials to save money
- gwbas1c 7y agoWhen I bought my Docs in 2015 I paid a few extra dollars for the ones made in the UK. At the time, Vegan was an option, but why skimp on the real thing?
- Lio 7y agoWhen DMs were originally made in the UK the work was contracted out. The company that originally made them for Doctor Martins now sells direct under the name Solavair [1] made in the same original factory. I have no connection to the company but I have a pair of their monkey boots and they’re great. Oh and I _think_ they might make DMs “made in the UK” specials but I’m not 100% on that. 1. https://www.nps-solovair.com/ https://www.nps-solovair.com/
- snapetom 7y agoThat's great information, thank you. And they have a vegan model!
- snapetom 7y agoEven after 2002, I feel like the quality was fine. However, there have been huge quality issues in the past couple of years. I seem to remember DM had at least one vegan boot around the early 2000's. The article says the "line" started in 2011, but I'm pretty sure I had a pair well before that. I think there were earlier attempts to sell a model of the vegans, and one model doesn't qualify it as a "line." At around 2011, I started to buy vegan docs exclusively as an everyday shoe. They were amazing. One lasted about 4 years. However, my last pair which I bought in late 2017(?), didn't last eight months with both soles splitting. This current pair is a bit better (10 months now?). The sole on one is starting to split, but at least the soles is pretty worn down.
- harimau777 7y agoSlightly off topic, but are there any "vegan leathers" that replicate the properties of leather (durability, strength, toughness, breathability, etc.) rather than just the appearance?
- chrisseaton 7y agoThe great thing about leather is when the surface gets trashed you can polish it again and it’s as good as new. You can wear a pair of boots for weeks in the mountains and then polish again to a mirror finish (meaning perfectly waterproof.) With all synthetic leathers there’s some kind of surface which once it’s broken that’s it it’s ruined and there’s no way to repair and they need to be thrown away. Ask anyone who's ever tried to get way with plastic 'patent leather' boots and regretted it with the first scratch they get!
- goda90 7y agoThere was a group trying to make "leather" out of the skin that forms in fermenting kombucha. I'm not sure how well it matches actual leather, but there may be a future in lab grown leather similar to lab grown meat.
- sleepybrett 7y agoI think it falls into the same category as 'not at all sustainable' and maybe vegan. But I have a backpack who's outer skin is made from recycled bicycle inner-tubes sewn together to make a watertight surface. After years it's worn almost like leather, though I suspect eventually it will break down into a powder like an old rubber band. It start off as shiny but eventually developed minute scratches and turned quite matte and more plyable. It does not, of course, have that earthy leather smell and will forever smell somewhat of rubber inner-tubes. Sadly it seems like they no longer make the backpack I own but here is an example (https://www.alchemygoods.com/collections/upcycled-backpacks-and-messengers/products/brooklyn-backpack https://www.alchemygoods.com/collections/upcycled-backpacks-...)
- Animats 7y agoFor small values of "thriving". "Its vegan line, first launched in 2011, rose to 5% of its global footwear sales in its fiscal year ended March 31."
- pessimizer 7y agoThe favorite pair of shoes I ever owned in my life were a pair of Doc oxfords with light-brown hemp uppers, I tried to locate a pair years later only to find out that they were a limited production run in the early 90s. A new run would make a good marketing pairing with the pleathers; they both have that granola/crunchy feel, and pot's gone mainstream now. I'd love to own a pair again.
- jason_slack 7y agoI owned my first pair of Doc Martens when I was 15. I was in high school and saw that Eric Clapton wore a pair and I just loved the look. Now, 42, I own dozens of pairs of Docs and I still have the original ones from when I was 15. I own Vegan Docs and I love them. Every bit as good as the leather versions. However, I thought I was helping save cows but it turns out they are dying anyway. Sad.