4 ms·

What's the formal demands from the HK protests? Can someone point to some official documents from the protesters?

dawhizkid 7y ago
Carrie Lam's resignation, plus: The complete withdrawal of the proposed extradition bill The government to withdraw the use of the word “riot” in relation to protests The unconditional release of arrested protesters and charges against them dropped An independent inquiry into police behaviour Implementation of genuine universal suffrage Source: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/aug/13/what-do-the-hong-kong-protesters-want https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/aug/13/what-do-the-ho...
- baby 7y ago
  They want the word "riot" to be dismissed because it allows the gov to put protesters in jail for up to 10 years
- justicezyx 7y ago
  > The complete withdrawal of the proposed extradition bill Reasonable. > The government to withdraw the use of the word “riot” in relation to protests Unfortunately, not reasonable. OK, now it's no longer factual to say that it's not a "riot". I do not defend either side, but let's be sure to use the word correctly. > The unconditional release of arrested protesters and charges against them dropped Sorry, not reasonable. What about the protester who is claimed to bite off a police's finger: https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/law-and-crime/article/3018831/hong-kong-protester-appears-court-accused-biting https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/law-and-crime/article/30... > An independent inquiry into police behaviour Reasonable. But there will be an independent inquiry being requested on the protesters as well. I am not suggesting that, I am just saying obviously Chines government is going to demand that as well. > Implementation of genuine universal suffrage Moderately reasonable. You are asking a country to adopt a different political system in a prominent area. But if you want to retrieve the skin of a lion by asking politely, or assume you only suffer minor scratch, you'd better prepare to get killed.
  - NeedMoreTea 7y ago
    Universal suffrage in the election of the Chief Executive was definitely, and I think - though I'm not certain - of the legislative council was in the handover agreement. The Sino British agreement China was happy to sign and see lodged with the UN as binding international agreement. The one China says doesn't matter any more.
  - greycol 7y ago
    >>The government to withdraw the use of the word “riot” in relation to protests >Unfortunately, not reasonable. It's completely reasonable the word riot carries legal implications that should not apply here. It doesn't matter what the common definition of the noun is it matters how the government uses that word. It's the equivalent of a vegan saying "Meat is Murder" pointing out the technical definitions of the words then expecting all meat eaters to get arrested for at least conspiracy to commit murder. Not to cast false aspersions but I bet you can't even look at the image in the link below and write the same sentence about the other leader in this photo without fearing for your future. https://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-china-blog-40627855 https://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-china-blog-40627855 Sentence: Obama is Tigger. Now you write the full sentence : Xi Jinping is ____
baby 7y ago
Historically, there was only one: withdraw the extradiction bill. The amount of police violence during the protests have bumped that number to 5: https://twitter.com/HongKongHermit/status/1160409465637621760 https://twitter.com/HongKongHermit/status/116040946563762176...
- justicezyx 7y ago
  Well there is plenty of report on both side about polices being violent, and protesters being violent. I do not refute the idea that polices are violent at the beginning, after all, that's what they are hired to do. But the escalation of events pretty much marred the picture as a splendid mixes of colorful distortions. If anyone recall how CCP got the power, they got that through violence. It does not matter who is violent, the winner has to win in order to rewrite the history. And please be aware that demanding universal voting is calling for revolution.
  - pwinnski 7y ago
    A bully punches a child in the face for months, and once the child pushes back, there are people to say "it does not matter who is violent," and decry "the escalation of events." It does matter.
  - pimmen 7y ago
    > I do not refute the idea that polices are violent at the beginning, after all, that's what they are hired to do. I had extended family in law enforcement, and my brother is studying to become a police officer. They would be very offended to hear that police are hired to be violent. They're hired to enforce justice. A Hong Kong citizen speaking their mind against the government to achieve change is absolutely within the bounds of Hong Kong justice, to violently break up assemblies aimed at changing government policy by voicing discontent is far removed from the principles police forces like the one in Hong Kong were founded on. If they were deployed simply to be violent towards people who voice their opinion the government no longer functions within Hong Kong's basic law and they are no longer representing the people of Hong Kong. Just like the people of China has done multiple times towards rulers who don't represent them, the people of Hong Kong fought back.

Carrie Lam's resignation, plus: The complete withdrawal of the proposed extradition bill The government to withdraw the use of the word “riot” in relation to protests The unconditional release of arrested protesters and charges against them dropped An independent inquiry into police behaviour Implementation of genuine universal suffrage Source: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/aug/13/what-do-the-hong-kong-protesters-want https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/aug/13/what-do-the-ho...

baby 7y ago
They want the word "riot" to be dismissed because it allows the gov to put protesters in jail for up to 10 years
justicezyx 7y ago
> The complete withdrawal of the proposed extradition bill Reasonable. > The government to withdraw the use of the word “riot” in relation to protests Unfortunately, not reasonable. OK, now it's no longer factual to say that it's not a "riot". I do not defend either side, but let's be sure to use the word correctly. > The unconditional release of arrested protesters and charges against them dropped Sorry, not reasonable. What about the protester who is claimed to bite off a police's finger: https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/law-and-crime/article/3018831/hong-kong-protester-appears-court-accused-biting https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/law-and-crime/article/30... > An independent inquiry into police behaviour Reasonable. But there will be an independent inquiry being requested on the protesters as well. I am not suggesting that, I am just saying obviously Chines government is going to demand that as well. > Implementation of genuine universal suffrage Moderately reasonable. You are asking a country to adopt a different political system in a prominent area. But if you want to retrieve the skin of a lion by asking politely, or assume you only suffer minor scratch, you'd better prepare to get killed.
- NeedMoreTea 7y ago
  Universal suffrage in the election of the Chief Executive was definitely, and I think - though I'm not certain - of the legislative council was in the handover agreement. The Sino British agreement China was happy to sign and see lodged with the UN as binding international agreement. The one China says doesn't matter any more.
- greycol 7y ago
  >>The government to withdraw the use of the word “riot” in relation to protests >Unfortunately, not reasonable. It's completely reasonable the word riot carries legal implications that should not apply here. It doesn't matter what the common definition of the noun is it matters how the government uses that word. It's the equivalent of a vegan saying "Meat is Murder" pointing out the technical definitions of the words then expecting all meat eaters to get arrested for at least conspiracy to commit murder. Not to cast false aspersions but I bet you can't even look at the image in the link below and write the same sentence about the other leader in this photo without fearing for your future. https://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-china-blog-40627855 https://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-china-blog-40627855 Sentence: Obama is Tigger. Now you write the full sentence : Xi Jinping is ____

baby 7y ago

Historically, there was only one: withdraw the extradiction bill. The amount of police violence during the protests have bumped that number to 5: https://twitter.com/HongKongHermit/status/1160409465637621760 https://twitter.com/HongKongHermit/status/116040946563762176...

justicezyx 7y ago
Well there is plenty of report on both side about polices being violent, and protesters being violent. I do not refute the idea that polices are violent at the beginning, after all, that's what they are hired to do. But the escalation of events pretty much marred the picture as a splendid mixes of colorful distortions. If anyone recall how CCP got the power, they got that through violence. It does not matter who is violent, the winner has to win in order to rewrite the history. And please be aware that demanding universal voting is calling for revolution.
- pwinnski 7y ago
  A bully punches a child in the face for months, and once the child pushes back, there are people to say "it does not matter who is violent," and decry "the escalation of events." It does matter.
- pimmen 7y ago
  > I do not refute the idea that polices are violent at the beginning, after all, that's what they are hired to do. I had extended family in law enforcement, and my brother is studying to become a police officer. They would be very offended to hear that police are hired to be violent. They're hired to enforce justice. A Hong Kong citizen speaking their mind against the government to achieve change is absolutely within the bounds of Hong Kong justice, to violently break up assemblies aimed at changing government policy by voicing discontent is far removed from the principles police forces like the one in Hong Kong were founded on. If they were deployed simply to be violent towards people who voice their opinion the government no longer functions within Hong Kong's basic law and they are no longer representing the people of Hong Kong. Just like the people of China has done multiple times towards rulers who don't represent them, the people of Hong Kong fought back.