5 ms·

I think Teams is exactly excellent because it allows you to secure your collaboration tool. Especially valuable post GDPR where you really don’t want your non-t

by moksly 7y ago

I think Teams is exactly excellent because it allows you to secure your collaboration tool. Especially valuable post GDPR where you really don’t want your non-tech savy employers putting privacy data into some online Trello board, or slack/discord for that matter. The fact that teams is just part of your 365 platform is soooo awesome in non-tech enterprise that it’s hard to describe just how useful it is. But basically we have 7000 employees in my shop, 20% of them them can’t name the operating system iOS/Android/windows when they call support. You want your IT to protect them from themselves, even if that’s obviously not how you would word it in your strategy. Too much control is bad though, like you say, creating channels/teams/task-boards shouldn’t be too bureaucratic. We were a little too liberal when we first opened up, allowing people to name their own, which resulted in mail-list mayhem. Because Microsoft created an e-mail address with the name people chose. This resulted in the “specialised child care department” creating a “specialised childcare” e-mail address, that would show up in outlook. Which in term led to some rather important e-mails getting lost, because people sent them to the one of the now two “specialised child care” email addresses that wasn’t getting read. We fixed this by moving creation into our own tool and using the 365 API, so people still get to name their own collaboration projects, but they get a “Teams - “ in front of the name, and that’s filtered out of the e-mail listing so they don’t show up in the outlook address book. I don’t personally like Teams or Tasks all that much functionally wise compared to other tools, but the fact that they are part of our 365 security setup and the fact that we’ve already paid for them, means I’ll use them.

arsenico 7y ago
How is putting privacy data in Teams different from putting it in Slack?
- youdontknowtho 7y ago
  Teams benefits from the cross-product and service GDPR and eDiscovery tools that MS has built. It's hard to explain the scale of some of that stuff, but it cuts across O365.
- moksly 7y ago
  I’m the wrong person to ask, all I know is that Microsoft, Azure and Offfice365 is on the government list of places we can put our data (which doesn’t go above NSIS level 3) safely and legally. Slack isn’t on that list.
  - realusername 7y ago
    Apart from some abstract legal paperwork requirements like those, I honestly don't see much difference between both privacy wise. If the company really requires privacy and owning their data, they should setup some hosted slack clone themselves.
    - youdontknowtho 7y ago
      It's not that a company owns their data, or needs privacy, its that they need tools to discover customer or even non-customer data from across the entire suite of systems that they use. It's a tremendous amount of data and MS built tooling that helps do that across all of their services. Setting up some kind of hosted solution in a country to comply with data sovereignty laws might be a solution, but it becomes a data island that makes compliance with other regulatory regimes that much harder.
      - cannonedhamster 7y ago
        You can literally pull every single conversation private or not from Slack with a button push or email request. The company owns all that data. There doesn't appear to be anything special about how Teams does data retention from my perspective.
        youdontknowtho 7y ago
        Again, it's not about the company owning the data. For instance, regulatory requirements might mean that someone comes to you and says...give me every interaction and related data that references this person who doesn't work here. That would mean anytime they are mentioned in word docs, records in Salesforce, anytime someone mentioned them in chat or email, and everything else. I'm not saying that you aren't right. I'm just saying that the integration with other services allows for management at scale that is useful in large organizations. Instead of going to lots of individual services and exporting data into something that you can then use to ad-hoc query, you can go to one place and create a job that goes out and collects the data for you. That has value. In the end it gets back to the "best of breed" vs "pre-integrated"...It depends on how and where you assess value. For some people, just not using MS has value. For lot's of people/orgs having all the things integrated already, even if they aren't the best tools available, is a better value.
lozenge 7y ago
"I love how integrated it is but I had to write code to remove the integration that was counterproductive" I get it, but it seems contradictory, and your workaround is probably beyond reach for many smaller businesses.
- moksly 7y ago
  I get your point, but I’m not sure you can apply enterprise problems to small businesses. Take my specific example, my department has a mailing list called something along the lines of Digitalisation, we have this because we’re 7000 employees at 200+ locations and you can be pretty sure a teacher at one of our schools don’t know who I am or what my position is called. They would know that they need to contact Digitalisation, so we have a mailing list for it, just like this particular school has a naming list with the schools name in case I needed to contact them. That wouldn’t really be an issue when you have 50 employees in the same office. Aside from that, I think Microsoft actually ended up adding a standard feature to hide Teams mail-addresses from the outlook addressbook when we raised the issue with Seattle, we just needed the extra “Teams -“ to make it easier to maintain.
  - johnbatch 7y ago
    You can use a group naming policy to enforce your “Teams-“ prefix requirements [1]. Or you can use a custom domain policy so the email addresses are at “@teams.company.com” [2] 1.https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/office365/admin/create-groups/groups-naming-policy?view=o365-worldwide https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/office365/admin/create-grou... 2. https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/office365/admin/create-groups/choose-domain-to-create-groups https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/office365/admin/create-grou...
- laurentb 7y ago
  a simpler version of that workaround can be built with a powershell script (and hell, with a little bit of fiddling around, you can even use PowerApps as a front UI) in less than 2 days if not one morning.
ailideex 7y ago
Why is it okay to put data in teams and not in trello?
- cannonedhamster 7y ago
  Especially since Trello is owned by Atlassian. This one such me as weird too.
- PeterisP 7y ago
  When storing personal data outside of the organization, you need to have a proper agreement with data processor that handles all the GDPR-related issues, handles responsiblities and liability, verifies issues such as will the data be transferred outside EU jurisdiction to USA servers, etc. In general, organizations have these legal issues already settled with Microsoft due to their other contracts for e.g. Office and Azure and such. For any new vendor you can't put the same data unless/until you have all these legal arrangements in place; and if that vendor says "ah, we're in USA, we don't care about GDPR" then you simply can't use them for such data.

by moksly 7y ago

arsenico 7y ago

How is putting privacy data in Teams different from putting it in Slack?

youdontknowtho 7y ago
Teams benefits from the cross-product and service GDPR and eDiscovery tools that MS has built. It's hard to explain the scale of some of that stuff, but it cuts across O365.
moksly 7y ago
I’m the wrong person to ask, all I know is that Microsoft, Azure and Offfice365 is on the government list of places we can put our data (which doesn’t go above NSIS level 3) safely and legally. Slack isn’t on that list.
- realusername 7y ago
  Apart from some abstract legal paperwork requirements like those, I honestly don't see much difference between both privacy wise. If the company really requires privacy and owning their data, they should setup some hosted slack clone themselves.
  - youdontknowtho 7y ago
    It's not that a company owns their data, or needs privacy, its that they need tools to discover customer or even non-customer data from across the entire suite of systems that they use. It's a tremendous amount of data and MS built tooling that helps do that across all of their services. Setting up some kind of hosted solution in a country to comply with data sovereignty laws might be a solution, but it becomes a data island that makes compliance with other regulatory regimes that much harder.
    - cannonedhamster 7y ago
      You can literally pull every single conversation private or not from Slack with a button push or email request. The company owns all that data. There doesn't appear to be anything special about how Teams does data retention from my perspective.
      - youdontknowtho 7y ago
        Again, it's not about the company owning the data. For instance, regulatory requirements might mean that someone comes to you and says...give me every interaction and related data that references this person who doesn't work here. That would mean anytime they are mentioned in word docs, records in Salesforce, anytime someone mentioned them in chat or email, and everything else. I'm not saying that you aren't right. I'm just saying that the integration with other services allows for management at scale that is useful in large organizations. Instead of going to lots of individual services and exporting data into something that you can then use to ad-hoc query, you can go to one place and create a job that goes out and collects the data for you. That has value. In the end it gets back to the "best of breed" vs "pre-integrated"...It depends on how and where you assess value. For some people, just not using MS has value. For lot's of people/orgs having all the things integrated already, even if they aren't the best tools available, is a better value.

lozenge 7y ago

"I love how integrated it is but I had to write code to remove the integration that was counterproductive" I get it, but it seems contradictory, and your workaround is probably beyond reach for many smaller businesses.

moksly 7y ago
I get your point, but I’m not sure you can apply enterprise problems to small businesses. Take my specific example, my department has a mailing list called something along the lines of Digitalisation, we have this because we’re 7000 employees at 200+ locations and you can be pretty sure a teacher at one of our schools don’t know who I am or what my position is called. They would know that they need to contact Digitalisation, so we have a mailing list for it, just like this particular school has a naming list with the schools name in case I needed to contact them. That wouldn’t really be an issue when you have 50 employees in the same office. Aside from that, I think Microsoft actually ended up adding a standard feature to hide Teams mail-addresses from the outlook addressbook when we raised the issue with Seattle, we just needed the extra “Teams -“ to make it easier to maintain.
- johnbatch 7y ago
  You can use a group naming policy to enforce your “Teams-“ prefix requirements [1]. Or you can use a custom domain policy so the email addresses are at “@teams.company.com” [2] 1.https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/office365/admin/create-groups/groups-naming-policy?view=o365-worldwide https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/office365/admin/create-grou... 2. https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/office365/admin/create-groups/choose-domain-to-create-groups https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/office365/admin/create-grou...
laurentb 7y ago
a simpler version of that workaround can be built with a powershell script (and hell, with a little bit of fiddling around, you can even use PowerApps as a front UI) in less than 2 days if not one morning.

ailideex 7y ago

Why is it okay to put data in teams and not in trello?

cannonedhamster 7y ago
Especially since Trello is owned by Atlassian. This one such me as weird too.
PeterisP 7y ago
When storing personal data outside of the organization, you need to have a proper agreement with data processor that handles all the GDPR-related issues, handles responsiblities and liability, verifies issues such as will the data be transferred outside EU jurisdiction to USA servers, etc. In general, organizations have these legal issues already settled with Microsoft due to their other contracts for e.g. Office and Azure and such. For any new vendor you can't put the same data unless/until you have all these legal arrangements in place; and if that vendor says "ah, we're in USA, we don't care about GDPR" then you simply can't use them for such data.