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>Whether it's seen next to porn should be irrelevant. It does not work that way. If some average person sees some brand advertised on WSJ and FT, and another c

>Whether it's seen next to porn should be irrelevant. It does not work that way. If some average person sees some brand advertised on WSJ and FT, and another competing brand on PornHub he will attach more 'premium' value to a first brand, and will pay more for owning product from this brand. It's only normal and a part of human nature. People enjoy content from PornHub, but they want to be associated with something advertised on WSJ/FT/NYT/etc. People want to signal status, not just own a good stuff.

420codebro 7y ago
Honest question: Is is status signaling, or an attempt to avoid the wrath of the [ad buying] puritans?
rxhernandez 7y ago
> people want to signal status People are biological animals first and humans at a distant second. It's short-sighted to so brazenly dismiss the long term effects of periodically associating a brand with the strong feelings that come with an orgasm.
- nopriorarrests 7y ago
  >From my experience in dealing with very rich and very poor people of many different cultures, the only people who give a damn about status to that extent are the young and dumb Sorry, you are mostly wrong here. Let me present you with example of an ad targeted to 50+ very rich audience. This is an ad directed by Cohen brothers ("Big Lebowski", "No Country For Old Men", etc) advertising Mercedes AMG Roadster and shown during SuperBowl -- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=exxaJrtH2kg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=exxaJrtH2kg -- and pay attention to a punchline -- "still looking good". Pure signaling for an older folks. This may sound illogical, but most people who buy "signaling" products (such as Mercedes AMG Roadster) are in +40 y.o. cohort. They got money to spend, unlike millenials who can only signal status while choosing craft beer on Friday evening. Also, your guess about me living in my "pristine little bubble" was too personal, tbh, but I'm fine with that. No offense taken here.
  - rxhernandez 7y ago
    > Let me present you with example of an ad targeted to 50+ very rich audience. This is an ad directed by Cohen brothers ("Big Lebowski", "No Country For Old Men", etc) advertising Mercedes AMG Roadster and shown during SuperBowl These concepts are not mutually exclusive concepts: - targeting a group of people that are 50+ years old - for the people that actually buy the cars to be vain, young and dumb, and insecure. > This may sound illogical, but most people who buy "signaling" products (such as Mercedes AMG Roadster) are in +40 y.o. cohort. That's not illogical at all; that's mainly who I see in Porsche dealerships and nothing about that contradicts what I said. In that individual statement, I was merely commenting on the set of people who care about their things being associated with a porn advertisement, not the intersection of people who care about status to that extent and have money to signal their status. > Also, your guess about me living in my "pristine little bubble" was too personal, tbh, but I'm fine with that. No offense taken here. It was, I'm sorry about that and I've removed it; Frankly, I am frustrated and probably overly sensitive (to the point of false positives) to the trend I noticed in the Bay area where people who couldn't be bothered to leave their home/tech bubble and interact with people outside their comfort zone, remarking on how people the world over work. Their abstractions are incredibly wrong if you just go 50 miles outside the bay area. Due to having family and their friends spread out over the world and due to having a remote job, I've seen and lived with people of diverse cultural and socioeconomic backgrounds; the Bay rarely understands any of those people except those in their bubble and despite that, it's not uncommon for them to speak with authority on them; I find that audacity infuriating and is something I need to work on.
    - nopriorarrests 7y ago
      >That's not illogical at all, that's mainly who I see in Porsche dealerships and nothing about that contradicts what I said. I don't know, I think signaling is OK, and I don't consider people why buy signaling products as "vain dumb and insecure". I just don't see that anything wrong with that. I mean, you made enough money to choose good, quality product, be that t-shirt, bike or even a car. Why not choose some premium brand with some signaling attached to that, instead of just buying generic nike t-shirt or toyota corolla car? If you like that Mercedes AMG Roadster because you think that it will make you more attractive to chicks (and btw it will, I guarantee) -- and you got money to spare, well, go for it! You made enough money to buy Porsche 911, why drive Honda Civic then? I see people signaling with their choices wrt premium products, and I don't judge them at all. >Frankly, I am frustrated with a common trend I noticed in the Bay area where people who couldn't be bothered to leave their home/tech bubble and interact with people outside their comfort zone I've never visited USA in my life, and do not plan to, so your guess about me being SF resident living in SF bubble is wrong. :) I do work in ad-tech / advertising, though, so I learned something about how industry works. JIC, during my daily commute (I don't own a car and use public transit) I see more people who make $500/month than people who make $5000/month, so no bubble here. :)
coldtea 7y ago
>It does not work that way. If some average person sees some brand advertised on WSJ and FT, and another competing brand on PornHub he will attach more 'premium' value to a first brand, and will pay more for owning product from this brand. That doesn't explain the connection of "porn" with "less than premium". You call it "normal and part of human nature" but looks like totally cultural. Historical prudery, and a past that associated looking at adult content with "low status", lesser citizens (and not what the "proper people do", does explain it. (While we of course know that people of all statuses and walks of life look at porn, from the industrialist, to the bank executive, to the judge). >People enjoy content from PornHub, but they want to be associated with something advertised on WSJ/FT/NYT/etc. I'd understand it if we were talking about high status ads, yaugt ads, hi-fi ads, expensive clothes ads, and so on. But most people don't read or care for WSJ/FT/NYT -- that's a small minority. Most people read magazines just as popular/mass market as People, Reader's Digest, CNN, FOX, USA Today and the like, and advertisers have no issue advertising at those.
- brettz 7y ago
  There is still massive stigma around consuming porn. Less than half of Americans think that watching porn is morally acceptable. https://news.gallup.com/poll/235280/americans-say-pornography-morally-acceptable.aspx https://news.gallup.com/poll/235280/americans-say-pornograph... Brands don't want to be next to content that has that stigma.
  - asdff 7y ago
    The people with that stigma aren't going to be looking at that content anyway.
    - mijamo 7y ago
      Oh yeah, nobody would do something they say is immoral, especially when it comes to sex.
    - brettz 7y ago
      They think it's immoral but they definitely still look at that content. For advertisers it's about brand perception and not appearing next to immoral content.

420codebro 7y ago

Honest question: Is is status signaling, or an attempt to avoid the wrath of the [ad buying] puritans?

rxhernandez 7y ago

> people want to signal status People are biological animals first and humans at a distant second. It's short-sighted to so brazenly dismiss the long term effects of periodically associating a brand with the strong feelings that come with an orgasm.

nopriorarrests 7y ago
>From my experience in dealing with very rich and very poor people of many different cultures, the only people who give a damn about status to that extent are the young and dumb Sorry, you are mostly wrong here. Let me present you with example of an ad targeted to 50+ very rich audience. This is an ad directed by Cohen brothers ("Big Lebowski", "No Country For Old Men", etc) advertising Mercedes AMG Roadster and shown during SuperBowl -- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=exxaJrtH2kg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=exxaJrtH2kg -- and pay attention to a punchline -- "still looking good". Pure signaling for an older folks. This may sound illogical, but most people who buy "signaling" products (such as Mercedes AMG Roadster) are in +40 y.o. cohort. They got money to spend, unlike millenials who can only signal status while choosing craft beer on Friday evening. Also, your guess about me living in my "pristine little bubble" was too personal, tbh, but I'm fine with that. No offense taken here.
- rxhernandez 7y ago
  > Let me present you with example of an ad targeted to 50+ very rich audience. This is an ad directed by Cohen brothers ("Big Lebowski", "No Country For Old Men", etc) advertising Mercedes AMG Roadster and shown during SuperBowl These concepts are not mutually exclusive concepts: - targeting a group of people that are 50+ years old - for the people that actually buy the cars to be vain, young and dumb, and insecure. > This may sound illogical, but most people who buy "signaling" products (such as Mercedes AMG Roadster) are in +40 y.o. cohort. That's not illogical at all; that's mainly who I see in Porsche dealerships and nothing about that contradicts what I said. In that individual statement, I was merely commenting on the set of people who care about their things being associated with a porn advertisement, not the intersection of people who care about status to that extent and have money to signal their status. > Also, your guess about me living in my "pristine little bubble" was too personal, tbh, but I'm fine with that. No offense taken here. It was, I'm sorry about that and I've removed it; Frankly, I am frustrated and probably overly sensitive (to the point of false positives) to the trend I noticed in the Bay area where people who couldn't be bothered to leave their home/tech bubble and interact with people outside their comfort zone, remarking on how people the world over work. Their abstractions are incredibly wrong if you just go 50 miles outside the bay area. Due to having family and their friends spread out over the world and due to having a remote job, I've seen and lived with people of diverse cultural and socioeconomic backgrounds; the Bay rarely understands any of those people except those in their bubble and despite that, it's not uncommon for them to speak with authority on them; I find that audacity infuriating and is something I need to work on.
  - nopriorarrests 7y ago
    >That's not illogical at all, that's mainly who I see in Porsche dealerships and nothing about that contradicts what I said. I don't know, I think signaling is OK, and I don't consider people why buy signaling products as "vain dumb and insecure". I just don't see that anything wrong with that. I mean, you made enough money to choose good, quality product, be that t-shirt, bike or even a car. Why not choose some premium brand with some signaling attached to that, instead of just buying generic nike t-shirt or toyota corolla car? If you like that Mercedes AMG Roadster because you think that it will make you more attractive to chicks (and btw it will, I guarantee) -- and you got money to spare, well, go for it! You made enough money to buy Porsche 911, why drive Honda Civic then? I see people signaling with their choices wrt premium products, and I don't judge them at all. >Frankly, I am frustrated with a common trend I noticed in the Bay area where people who couldn't be bothered to leave their home/tech bubble and interact with people outside their comfort zone I've never visited USA in my life, and do not plan to, so your guess about me being SF resident living in SF bubble is wrong. :) I do work in ad-tech / advertising, though, so I learned something about how industry works. JIC, during my daily commute (I don't own a car and use public transit) I see more people who make $500/month than people who make $5000/month, so no bubble here. :)

coldtea 7y ago

>It does not work that way. If some average person sees some brand advertised on WSJ and FT, and another competing brand on PornHub he will attach more 'premium' value to a first brand, and will pay more for owning product from this brand. That doesn't explain the connection of "porn" with "less than premium". You call it "normal and part of human nature" but looks like totally cultural. Historical prudery, and a past that associated looking at adult content with "low status", lesser citizens (and not what the "proper people do", does explain it. (While we of course know that people of all statuses and walks of life look at porn, from the industrialist, to the bank executive, to the judge). >People enjoy content from PornHub, but they want to be associated with something advertised on WSJ/FT/NYT/etc. I'd understand it if we were talking about high status ads, yaugt ads, hi-fi ads, expensive clothes ads, and so on. But most people don't read or care for WSJ/FT/NYT -- that's a small minority. Most people read magazines just as popular/mass market as People, Reader's Digest, CNN, FOX, USA Today and the like, and advertisers have no issue advertising at those.

brettz 7y ago
There is still massive stigma around consuming porn. Less than half of Americans think that watching porn is morally acceptable. https://news.gallup.com/poll/235280/americans-say-pornography-morally-acceptable.aspx https://news.gallup.com/poll/235280/americans-say-pornograph... Brands don't want to be next to content that has that stigma.
- asdff 7y ago
  The people with that stigma aren't going to be looking at that content anyway.
  - mijamo 7y ago
    Oh yeah, nobody would do something they say is immoral, especially when it comes to sex.
  - brettz 7y ago
    They think it's immoral but they definitely still look at that content. For advertisers it's about brand perception and not appearing next to immoral content.