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This comment couldn't be more counter-productive. The article makes it clear that a feeling of anxiety at certain times is completely normal; it is when that a

by nness 7y ago

This comment couldn't be more counter-productive. The article makes it clear that a feeling of anxiety at certain times is completely normal; it is when that anxiety is affects your daily life, causing you distress, or leads to depression or harm should it be concidered an anxiety disorder. The article notes that men can react to or present with anxiety differently; and that representation is ignored, leading to a reduction in their quality of life. Dimissing it, as you have, is exactly what prevents men from receiving mental health support and society, at large, from recognising mental health issues in men.

nickjj 7y ago
> ...it is when that anxiety is affects your daily life, causing you distress, or leads to depression or harm should it be concidered an anxiety disorder. But what if your lifestyle is the cause of that anxiety / depression? I think that's what the commenter was trying to say. Imagine working long hours in a job you hate to barely live pay check to pay check, and on top of that you're in a poor relationship. Every minute of every day is worrying about paying your next bill. You have no savings and are in debt. You haven't been on vacation in 15+ years and every time you enter your apartment, it's uncomfortable because you either fight with your partner or you ignore each other, but you stay together because you can't afford to live on your own. On top of that your diet is garbage because poor nutritional foods are usually cheaper than healthy foods unless you're a master cook, but who has the time or energy for that with the above life style. The above is pretty common for a lot of people. Maybe not everything happens to everyone at once, but all it takes is to be in a shitty work situation for little pay (very common) and that's enough to train your brain into thinking life is an un-escapable torture chamber. You'd have to be crazy not to always be on edge and depressed if that was your life day in and day out. Fortunately I'm not talking from personal experience from all of the above but I do like psychology and a number of respectful psychologists are in agreement that you can get in a very bad mental state from your life style and a lot of people have made drastic mental health improvements by removing the things that cause them daily stress.
pizza 7y ago
The GP's comment merely says that your environment can have a huge detrimental impact on your mental health. In no way is that dismissive of seeking help. They even applaud the use of the 'normal' tools. In fact, the scenario that you describe of a person exhibiting symptoms of anxiety disorder because every day is distressing is pretty much exactly the same scenario the GP is saying about a life-setup that is causing you harm.
jacobolus 7y ago
If you are chronically stressed because you are working a terrible job, have overwhelming family obligations, etc., that doesn’t necessarily mean you have an “anxiety disorder”. It might instead be that your anxiety is a perfectly natural response to bad circumstances. To fix the problem it would be better to address the causes of the stress instead of trying to just treat symptoms. At a societal scale, it would be better to e.g. improve worker protection laws, expand the social safety net, subsidize childcare for working parents, crack down on fraudulent business practices, allow people to discharge student loan debt in bankruptcy, make sure skilled immigrant workers can switch employers without losing their immigration status, work to reduce domestic violence, reform the criminal justice system, etc. instead of just expanding access to anxiolytic medication or pretending that therapy alone can solve all problems. For an individual, the proper response might be to quit a job, start saying “no” to demands to work overtime, break up with an abusive partner, sit down and have a frank conversation with overly demanding parents, declare bankruptcy, take a leave of absence from college, let someone else take over maintaining the open source project, ...
- BurningFrog 7y ago
  This is the kind of thinking that CBT addresses. Of course lowering your stress level is always a valid response, if possible. But it is possible to handle even very stressful situations without damaging yourself with anxiety and depression. These are skills you can build up, and are very useful to have.
- bitcurious 7y ago
  > To fix the problem it would be better to address the causes of the stress instead of trying to just treat symptoms. The effect of depression, anxiety, and a host of other mental illnesses is that they prevent you from taking steps to address the addressable issues in your life. To start exercising while depressed, to start socializing while suffering from anxiety, etc., are some of the hardest things to do. That’s why medication is typically paired with counseling - the medication prepares you to take the steps the counseling guides you into taking. To put it another way, anxiety disorders (and depression, and ADHD, and more) take away agency. The purpose of medication is to reintroduce agency. The medication (for most people) won’t fix their problems, but it will help them fix them.
psweber 7y ago
I don't believe I meant what you think I meant. I intended to make a comment about our society creating unnecessary anxiety. I hope we look at the cause of the anxiety instead of just treating the symptoms. I do want people to see mental health professionals if they are suffering. I fear that option isn't available to many people that need the help, so I'd like to see a societal change in the pressures we put on each other and the ways we live our lives.

by nness 7y ago

nickjj 7y ago

> ...it is when that anxiety is affects your daily life, causing you distress, or leads to depression or harm should it be concidered an anxiety disorder. But what if your lifestyle is the cause of that anxiety / depression? I think that's what the commenter was trying to say. Imagine working long hours in a job you hate to barely live pay check to pay check, and on top of that you're in a poor relationship. Every minute of every day is worrying about paying your next bill. You have no savings and are in debt. You haven't been on vacation in 15+ years and every time you enter your apartment, it's uncomfortable because you either fight with your partner or you ignore each other, but you stay together because you can't afford to live on your own. On top of that your diet is garbage because poor nutritional foods are usually cheaper than healthy foods unless you're a master cook, but who has the time or energy for that with the above life style. The above is pretty common for a lot of people. Maybe not everything happens to everyone at once, but all it takes is to be in a shitty work situation for little pay (very common) and that's enough to train your brain into thinking life is an un-escapable torture chamber. You'd have to be crazy not to always be on edge and depressed if that was your life day in and day out. Fortunately I'm not talking from personal experience from all of the above but I do like psychology and a number of respectful psychologists are in agreement that you can get in a very bad mental state from your life style and a lot of people have made drastic mental health improvements by removing the things that cause them daily stress.

pizza 7y ago

The GP's comment merely says that your environment can have a huge detrimental impact on your mental health. In no way is that dismissive of seeking help. They even applaud the use of the 'normal' tools. In fact, the scenario that you describe of a person exhibiting symptoms of anxiety disorder because every day is distressing is pretty much exactly the same scenario the GP is saying about a life-setup that is causing you harm.

jacobolus 7y ago

If you are chronically stressed because you are working a terrible job, have overwhelming family obligations, etc., that doesn’t necessarily mean you have an “anxiety disorder”. It might instead be that your anxiety is a perfectly natural response to bad circumstances. To fix the problem it would be better to address the causes of the stress instead of trying to just treat symptoms. At a societal scale, it would be better to e.g. improve worker protection laws, expand the social safety net, subsidize childcare for working parents, crack down on fraudulent business practices, allow people to discharge student loan debt in bankruptcy, make sure skilled immigrant workers can switch employers without losing their immigration status, work to reduce domestic violence, reform the criminal justice system, etc. instead of just expanding access to anxiolytic medication or pretending that therapy alone can solve all problems. For an individual, the proper response might be to quit a job, start saying “no” to demands to work overtime, break up with an abusive partner, sit down and have a frank conversation with overly demanding parents, declare bankruptcy, take a leave of absence from college, let someone else take over maintaining the open source project, ...

BurningFrog 7y ago
This is the kind of thinking that CBT addresses. Of course lowering your stress level is always a valid response, if possible. But it is possible to handle even very stressful situations without damaging yourself with anxiety and depression. These are skills you can build up, and are very useful to have.
bitcurious 7y ago
> To fix the problem it would be better to address the causes of the stress instead of trying to just treat symptoms. The effect of depression, anxiety, and a host of other mental illnesses is that they prevent you from taking steps to address the addressable issues in your life. To start exercising while depressed, to start socializing while suffering from anxiety, etc., are some of the hardest things to do. That’s why medication is typically paired with counseling - the medication prepares you to take the steps the counseling guides you into taking. To put it another way, anxiety disorders (and depression, and ADHD, and more) take away agency. The purpose of medication is to reintroduce agency. The medication (for most people) won’t fix their problems, but it will help them fix them.

psweber 7y ago

I don't believe I meant what you think I meant. I intended to make a comment about our society creating unnecessary anxiety. I hope we look at the cause of the anxiety instead of just treating the symptoms. I do want people to see mental health professionals if they are suffering. I fear that option isn't available to many people that need the help, so I'd like to see a societal change in the pressures we put on each other and the ways we live our lives.