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I imagine a world where the electricity grid is intelligent enough to have a "conversation" with appliances to efficiently spread load across the day, more accu

by jgust 7y ago

I imagine a world where the electricity grid is intelligent enough to have a "conversation" with appliances to efficiently spread load across the day, more accurately plan capacity, and do it at a lower cost to consumers and the environment.

pi-rat 7y ago
That's happening here, my power company has a GraphQL API[1] where I can read my current consumption (5 second resolution), they also offer up the current price, including an indicator of the price level compared to how they see the rest of the day (CHEAP, NORMAL, EXPENSIVE). All houses/apartments in Norway got new smart power meters the last couple of years. They standardized on a data interface (a bus you can connect to using a RJ45 plug), so you can access your own data if you don't want to go via your power companies API. There are EV chargers[2] and other appliances (Heat pumps/ACs) that can react to this price indicator, charging your car when power is cheapest. It will also load balance based on how much the rest of your house is using, they're moving towards an "wattage" fee here, to avoid massive loads at peak hours. If you get near the limit, the car charger can slow down. Here's some images of what their app gives me[3]. It's easy to pull their data into home automation systems, here's mine[4]. You can do pretty smart stuff like: Charge my car when it's cheap, but it must be ready by 07:00. [1]: https://developer.tibber.com/docs/guides/calling-api https://developer.tibber.com/docs/guides/calling-api [2]: https://norge.tibber.com/products/easee/ https://norge.tibber.com/products/easee/ [3]: https://imgur.com/a/RYYqcjY https://imgur.com/a/RYYqcjY [4]: https://imgur.com/a/8ef0jck https://imgur.com/a/8ef0jck
- rconti 7y ago
  Very cool! I seem to recall first reading about such plans as early as the 90s. It almost certainly wouldn't be allowed most places in the US because regulatory schemes always need approval to change, and it would be considered suspicious and an attempt to hide 'true' costs from the consumer (eg, the power provider can just change the rate any time they want, it will hurt poor people who can't afford these smart appliances, etc etc. Too bad.
  - pi-rat 7y ago
    In our case the power provider, the to the house line owner and the producer are all separate. My provides buys from the cheapest renewable offered up on NordPool. My fee to the provider is fixed (39 NOK per month). They don't get a cut of the cost per kwh to the producer. If one producer raise their price, they'll just be outbid. If they all raise their prices too much their reservoars will overflow. I pay the market price to the producer from the spot market + some percentage tax/fees to the government + line owner, and a flat fee to the provider. Makes it hard to get scammed by the power companies/providers I think. You'll get the current power source from their API or App. ATM I'm getting 100% hydro from "Kvitingen Kraftverk"[1], but that will probably change during the day. [1]: https://imgur.com/a/2uRhsZ2 https://imgur.com/a/2uRhsZ2 or https://imgur.com/a/oXeccnR https://imgur.com/a/oXeccnR (ocr translated)
    - jgust 7y ago
      Wow. The grid in the US sucks.

by jgust 7y ago

pi-rat 7y ago

That's happening here, my power company has a GraphQL API[1] where I can read my current consumption (5 second resolution), they also offer up the current price, including an indicator of the price level compared to how they see the rest of the day (CHEAP, NORMAL, EXPENSIVE). All houses/apartments in Norway got new smart power meters the last couple of years. They standardized on a data interface (a bus you can connect to using a RJ45 plug), so you can access your own data if you don't want to go via your power companies API. There are EV chargers[2] and other appliances (Heat pumps/ACs) that can react to this price indicator, charging your car when power is cheapest. It will also load balance based on how much the rest of your house is using, they're moving towards an "wattage" fee here, to avoid massive loads at peak hours. If you get near the limit, the car charger can slow down. Here's some images of what their app gives me[3]. It's easy to pull their data into home automation systems, here's mine[4]. You can do pretty smart stuff like: Charge my car when it's cheap, but it must be ready by 07:00. [1]: https://developer.tibber.com/docs/guides/calling-api https://developer.tibber.com/docs/guides/calling-api [2]: https://norge.tibber.com/products/easee/ https://norge.tibber.com/products/easee/ [3]: https://imgur.com/a/RYYqcjY https://imgur.com/a/RYYqcjY [4]: https://imgur.com/a/8ef0jck https://imgur.com/a/8ef0jck

rconti 7y ago
Very cool! I seem to recall first reading about such plans as early as the 90s. It almost certainly wouldn't be allowed most places in the US because regulatory schemes always need approval to change, and it would be considered suspicious and an attempt to hide 'true' costs from the consumer (eg, the power provider can just change the rate any time they want, it will hurt poor people who can't afford these smart appliances, etc etc. Too bad.
- pi-rat 7y ago
  In our case the power provider, the to the house line owner and the producer are all separate. My provides buys from the cheapest renewable offered up on NordPool. My fee to the provider is fixed (39 NOK per month). They don't get a cut of the cost per kwh to the producer. If one producer raise their price, they'll just be outbid. If they all raise their prices too much their reservoars will overflow. I pay the market price to the producer from the spot market + some percentage tax/fees to the government + line owner, and a flat fee to the provider. Makes it hard to get scammed by the power companies/providers I think. You'll get the current power source from their API or App. ATM I'm getting 100% hydro from "Kvitingen Kraftverk"[1], but that will probably change during the day. [1]: https://imgur.com/a/2uRhsZ2 https://imgur.com/a/2uRhsZ2 or https://imgur.com/a/oXeccnR https://imgur.com/a/oXeccnR (ocr translated)
  - jgust 7y ago
    Wow. The grid in the US sucks.