4 ms·

So here is an interesting question... why do I (and many others) like vi so much? Maybe modes are bad for beginners, but really good for experts.

crispinb 7y ago
I've never been a vi expert, but I've gone for long enough periods using vi keybindings to have been fluent with them. I think there is some kind of emotional/flow/mastery element - it just feels good to acquire these kinds of skills. I don't use vi keybindings now for a number of reasons. Not using them hasn't slowed me down (which may not mean much either way). But I do see the appeal.
- smacktoward 7y ago
  The article mentions one facet of this: once you’ve mastered a modal interface, it can feel really fast. It may or may not actually be fast, but it feels fast, and that is a pleasant feeling.
  - asutekku 7y ago
    I can definitely see that. Whereas doing something in vim requires multiple keybinds which may take a while to trigger, using mouse and some menu shortcut may take exactly the same amount of time. The shortcut version of vi just feels shorter because you’re doing something the whole time.
    - hnzix 7y ago
      > because you’re doing something the whole time." Exactly, while the elapsed time might not be much different there is less context switching so it's easier to stay in flow state.
    - zzo38computer 7y ago
      I do not agree; I think that if you can type fast then you can do it faster. (I have timed it, and so has at least one other person I know, actually.)
bakul 7y ago
In vi you can operate on N chars, words, lines etc. quite efficiently. Mouse based editing, at least beyond what you see on the screen, is more laborious and less accurate. Typing a regexp to find or replace, or moving to a specific location in the file is still modal in a mode less editor.
deleted 7y ago
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liability 7y ago
I like [e]vi[l] because there is less to learn. In normal mode if you learn N movements and M actions, then you've actually learned N*M things, not N+M. That means a little bit of studying pays off huge.
fouc 7y ago
Mode errors become easy to ignore at some point, but I actually noticed that I was definitely making a decent amount of mode errors for the first 2 years of my vi life. I wouldn't be surprised if most people don't actually notice this, but I'm sure it happens.
zzo38computer 7y ago
Comment 20671834 (by bakul) and 20671975 (by liability) make some good points. I also like vi. It is also why I made ZZTQED, being more modal than ZZT and KevEdit, and it also supports numeric command prefixes. I would also like it for TV/VCR, but, I have not seen such thing for a TV and VCR; many new ones don't even have numbered menus, and numbered menus are very advantageous.

crispinb 7y ago

I've never been a vi expert, but I've gone for long enough periods using vi keybindings to have been fluent with them. I think there is some kind of emotional/flow/mastery element - it just feels good to acquire these kinds of skills. I don't use vi keybindings now for a number of reasons. Not using them hasn't slowed me down (which may not mean much either way). But I do see the appeal.

smacktoward 7y ago
The article mentions one facet of this: once you’ve mastered a modal interface, it can feel really fast. It may or may not actually be fast, but it feels fast, and that is a pleasant feeling.
- asutekku 7y ago
  I can definitely see that. Whereas doing something in vim requires multiple keybinds which may take a while to trigger, using mouse and some menu shortcut may take exactly the same amount of time. The shortcut version of vi just feels shorter because you’re doing something the whole time.
  - hnzix 7y ago
    > because you’re doing something the whole time." Exactly, while the elapsed time might not be much different there is less context switching so it's easier to stay in flow state.
  - zzo38computer 7y ago
    I do not agree; I think that if you can type fast then you can do it faster. (I have timed it, and so has at least one other person I know, actually.)

bakul 7y ago

In vi you can operate on N chars, words, lines etc. quite efficiently. Mouse based editing, at least beyond what you see on the screen, is more laborious and less accurate. Typing a regexp to find or replace, or moving to a specific location in the file is still modal in a mode less editor.

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

liability 7y ago

I like [e]vi[l] because there is less to learn. In normal mode if you learn N movements and M actions, then you've actually learned N*M things, not N+M. That means a little bit of studying pays off huge.

fouc 7y ago

Mode errors become easy to ignore at some point, but I actually noticed that I was definitely making a decent amount of mode errors for the first 2 years of my vi life. I wouldn't be surprised if most people don't actually notice this, but I'm sure it happens.

zzo38computer 7y ago

Comment 20671834 (by bakul) and 20671975 (by liability) make some good points. I also like vi. It is also why I made ZZTQED, being more modal than ZZT and KevEdit, and it also supports numeric command prefixes. I would also like it for TV/VCR, but, I have not seen such thing for a TV and VCR; many new ones don't even have numbered menus, and numbered menus are very advantageous.