6 ms·

In defense of the article, what you are talking about is a different story more "finding the Internet and programming" that isn't really unique to Hacker News.

by ckris 7y ago

In defense of the article, what you are talking about is a different story more "finding the Internet and programming" that isn't really unique to Hacker News. It can surely be used that way, and people likely do, but you can also find those things by searching for "top programming books" (or hanging around twitter, quora, medium or other sites). They did sort of talk about that with the early motivations for Hacker News. And you could absolutely go to a music festival and write about the food trucks, the people and the atmosphere that if that is what unique about that festival. I think they did a good job in that regard. People don't obsessively read Hacker News to help newcomers, they do so because it is all in all a technical tabloid.

mushufasa 7y ago
I don't see HN as an intro course to programming, but more of like that older kid on the block who you notice is listening to bob dylan, and then you try again, you start to get past that nasally voice, really listening to the lyrics this time, and now you're turned on to a whole world of good music.
- 18pfsmt 7y ago
  [I, honestly, am hostile to n00b accounts discussing non-tech topics.] I agreed with you from your opening thread until you held high Dylan's lyrics, rather than his instrumentally produced melodies which entranced me in the 80s. Poetry is not legalese or code, and is open to interpretaion.
  - 18pfsmt 7y ago
    Downvotes, but no arguments, because they have none. It is quite sick.
  - dang 7y ago
    There's no requirement to explain downvotes on HN, because for every comment that added signal that way, there would be a thousand that added noise. That means each of us has to sort of figure out what led their comment to get downvoted. It's slower perhaps, but doable. In the case of your parent comment, the bit about hostility to noob accounts wasn't very kind, and the rest of the comment was sort of shallow and dismissive. Those things lead correctly to downvotes because they're against the site guidelines. Ditto for https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20650649 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20650649. Probably your best bet would be to review https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and take the intended spirit of the site more to heart when commenting here. We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20649242 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20649242 and marked it off-topic.
    - 18pfsmt 7y ago
      >There's no requirement to explain downvotes I know this. I was annoyed and responded in juvenile fashion. I was wrong. > the bit about hostility to noob accounts wasn't very kind You know far better than I, that these green accounts are created with reckless abandon and they weigh-in to controversial topics without any credibility. I realize you have access to server logs, so I'm not questioning your superior knowledge WRT the topic. I openly admit I have deficiencies in my self-discipline, but if it ever gets too much for you, just tell me I'm unwelcome and I will not comment. I'm no zealot even if I have a propensity to over-react.
      - dang 7y ago
        > I openly admit I have deficiencies in my self-discipline That makes two of us. Of course you're welcome to comment here. All we ask is that you review the site guidelines semi-regularly and work at following them—not because you're somehow deficient but because we all have to do this. They don't exactly come naturally—certainly not to me. I'm sure it's true you're no zealot. As for propensity to overreact, one trick I use is to set 'delay' in my profile to 1 (it can be 0-10 minutes). That way I'm the only person who sees my comment at first. That gives me time to re-read it outside of the edit box, and I usually notice something I want to change.
        18pfsmt 7y ago
        >That makes two of us. You're a parent, which seems to make a difference WRT empathy. I can openly admit that I share the viewpoints of Spock more often. Principles are costly. I never investigated 'delay,' nor have I ever seen it discussed on HN, esp. compared to 'showdead' or 'noprocrast.'
        dang 7y ago
        It's in the FAQ, but admittedly obscure, if something in a FAQ can be obscure. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsfaq.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsfaq.html
- ckris 7y ago
  Sure. I should clarify that I didn't mean "lmgtfy". There are five to ten books that covers things most programmers won't learn by practicing and therefor will uncover most of the mystery experienced by self-taught programmers. There is no need to listening really hard to the lyrics when you can learn how to play. You just need to go and read material that actually covers how to design programs, rather than are about "learning programming". And you will literally find those books about algorithms, design patterns, workflow, refactoring and whatever else by searching for "top programming books". Or in discussion on most platforms. I don't think it is as esoteric as you think.
- navigatesol 7y ago
  And sometimes people think Bob Dylan is overrated, that's okay too.

by ckris 7y ago

mushufasa 7y ago

I don't see HN as an intro course to programming, but more of like that older kid on the block who you notice is listening to bob dylan, and then you try again, you start to get past that nasally voice, really listening to the lyrics this time, and now you're turned on to a whole world of good music.

18pfsmt 7y ago
[I, honestly, am hostile to n00b accounts discussing non-tech topics.] I agreed with you from your opening thread until you held high Dylan's lyrics, rather than his instrumentally produced melodies which entranced me in the 80s. Poetry is not legalese or code, and is open to interpretaion.
- 18pfsmt 7y ago
  Downvotes, but no arguments, because they have none. It is quite sick.
- dang 7y ago
  There's no requirement to explain downvotes on HN, because for every comment that added signal that way, there would be a thousand that added noise. That means each of us has to sort of figure out what led their comment to get downvoted. It's slower perhaps, but doable. In the case of your parent comment, the bit about hostility to noob accounts wasn't very kind, and the rest of the comment was sort of shallow and dismissive. Those things lead correctly to downvotes because they're against the site guidelines. Ditto for https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20650649 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20650649. Probably your best bet would be to review https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and take the intended spirit of the site more to heart when commenting here. We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20649242 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20649242 and marked it off-topic.
  - 18pfsmt 7y ago
    >There's no requirement to explain downvotes I know this. I was annoyed and responded in juvenile fashion. I was wrong. > the bit about hostility to noob accounts wasn't very kind You know far better than I, that these green accounts are created with reckless abandon and they weigh-in to controversial topics without any credibility. I realize you have access to server logs, so I'm not questioning your superior knowledge WRT the topic. I openly admit I have deficiencies in my self-discipline, but if it ever gets too much for you, just tell me I'm unwelcome and I will not comment. I'm no zealot even if I have a propensity to over-react.
    - dang 7y ago
      > I openly admit I have deficiencies in my self-discipline That makes two of us. Of course you're welcome to comment here. All we ask is that you review the site guidelines semi-regularly and work at following them—not because you're somehow deficient but because we all have to do this. They don't exactly come naturally—certainly not to me. I'm sure it's true you're no zealot. As for propensity to overreact, one trick I use is to set 'delay' in my profile to 1 (it can be 0-10 minutes). That way I'm the only person who sees my comment at first. That gives me time to re-read it outside of the edit box, and I usually notice something I want to change.
      - 18pfsmt 7y ago
        >That makes two of us. You're a parent, which seems to make a difference WRT empathy. I can openly admit that I share the viewpoints of Spock more often. Principles are costly. I never investigated 'delay,' nor have I ever seen it discussed on HN, esp. compared to 'showdead' or 'noprocrast.'
        dang 7y ago
        It's in the FAQ, but admittedly obscure, if something in a FAQ can be obscure. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsfaq.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsfaq.html
ckris 7y ago
Sure. I should clarify that I didn't mean "lmgtfy". There are five to ten books that covers things most programmers won't learn by practicing and therefor will uncover most of the mystery experienced by self-taught programmers. There is no need to listening really hard to the lyrics when you can learn how to play. You just need to go and read material that actually covers how to design programs, rather than are about "learning programming". And you will literally find those books about algorithms, design patterns, workflow, refactoring and whatever else by searching for "top programming books". Or in discussion on most platforms. I don't think it is as esoteric as you think.
navigatesol 7y ago
And sometimes people think Bob Dylan is overrated, that's okay too.