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Or to driving control! But, engineers keep making this mistake. Hackers were able to take over Jeeps via the entertainment system: https://www.bbc.com/news/tec

by SilasX 7y ago

Or to driving control! But, engineers keep making this mistake. Hackers were able to take over Jeeps via the entertainment system: https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-33650491 https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-33650491 HN discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9942647 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9942647

jjtheblunt 7y ago
Take over as in turn off, not steer, right?
- SilasX 7y ago
  The article says “control” but doesn’t have a lot of specifics. In any case, for bad dudes that are pursuing you when people aren’t around, being able to shut down your car is just as bad as being able to control it.
  - blunte 7y ago
    Considering that cars are becoming more drive-by-wire, it's only a matter of time before a hacker will be able to actually steer a car or activate (or prevent activation of!) the brakes.
    - userbinator 7y ago
      it's only a matter of time before a hacker will be able to actually steer a car or activate (or prevent activation of!) the brakes. A Tesla is the perfect example. The fact that it has self-driving---I mean, "assisted cruise control"---naturally means a computer can take over the controls entirely.
      - blunte 7y ago
        I forget which car it was, but I watched a car review video recently where the presenter fussed about taking the (otherwise great) car to a track. Some of the assists couldn't be disabled, so going around the track he would occasionally have to fight the steering wheel when it would try to turn him a certain way to stay within a "lane".
- vokep 7y ago
  even if only, having your engine remotely killed while at speed on a freeway should not be a thing that is possible.
- luminiferous 7y ago
  From the original 2015 article about the hack: "Miller and Valasek’s full arsenal includes functions that at lower speeds fully kill the engine, abruptly engage the brakes, or disable them altogether. The most disturbing maneuver came when they cut the Jeep's brakes, leaving me frantically pumping the pedal as the 2-ton SUV slid uncontrollably into a ditch. The researchers say they're working on perfecting their steering control—for now they can only hijack the wheel when the Jeep is in reverse. Their hack enables surveillance too: They can track a targeted Jeep's GPS coordinates, measure its speed, and even drop pins on a map to trace its route."[1] The wheel control only working in reverse kind of makes sense. They're probably using some kind of self-park feature to control the wheel, and some engineer (sensibly) put in some kind of interlock to prevent the wheel from moving on its own when travelling at speed. The wording of the article implies that these particular attacks only work when the car is travelling at low speed, but earlier in the article they did mention that they could (and did!) throw the transmission into neutral while the Jeep was driving on the highway. The driver was unable to recover without turning the car off and back on again. In a followup a year later, they showed that they were able to do these attacks at any speed, including turning the steering wheel.[2] [1] https://www.wired.com/2015/07/hackers-remotely-kill-jeep-highway/ https://www.wired.com/2015/07/hackers-remotely-kill-jeep-hig... [2] https://www.wired.com/2016/08/jeep-hackers-return-high-speed-steering-acceleration-hacks/ https://www.wired.com/2016/08/jeep-hackers-return-high-speed...
- tgsovlerkhgsel 7y ago
  Some of the hacks demonstrated disabling brakes. All that's needed is disabling them, and then when the driver (or rather, passenger in the drivers seat of the death express) is frantically stomping on the brake, selectively re-enable them on one side.

by SilasX 7y ago

jjtheblunt 7y ago

Take over as in turn off, not steer, right?

SilasX 7y ago
The article says “control” but doesn’t have a lot of specifics. In any case, for bad dudes that are pursuing you when people aren’t around, being able to shut down your car is just as bad as being able to control it.
- blunte 7y ago
  Considering that cars are becoming more drive-by-wire, it's only a matter of time before a hacker will be able to actually steer a car or activate (or prevent activation of!) the brakes.
  - userbinator 7y ago
    it's only a matter of time before a hacker will be able to actually steer a car or activate (or prevent activation of!) the brakes. A Tesla is the perfect example. The fact that it has self-driving---I mean, "assisted cruise control"---naturally means a computer can take over the controls entirely.
    - blunte 7y ago
      I forget which car it was, but I watched a car review video recently where the presenter fussed about taking the (otherwise great) car to a track. Some of the assists couldn't be disabled, so going around the track he would occasionally have to fight the steering wheel when it would try to turn him a certain way to stay within a "lane".
vokep 7y ago
even if only, having your engine remotely killed while at speed on a freeway should not be a thing that is possible.
luminiferous 7y ago
From the original 2015 article about the hack: "Miller and Valasek’s full arsenal includes functions that at lower speeds fully kill the engine, abruptly engage the brakes, or disable them altogether. The most disturbing maneuver came when they cut the Jeep's brakes, leaving me frantically pumping the pedal as the 2-ton SUV slid uncontrollably into a ditch. The researchers say they're working on perfecting their steering control—for now they can only hijack the wheel when the Jeep is in reverse. Their hack enables surveillance too: They can track a targeted Jeep's GPS coordinates, measure its speed, and even drop pins on a map to trace its route."[1] The wheel control only working in reverse kind of makes sense. They're probably using some kind of self-park feature to control the wheel, and some engineer (sensibly) put in some kind of interlock to prevent the wheel from moving on its own when travelling at speed. The wording of the article implies that these particular attacks only work when the car is travelling at low speed, but earlier in the article they did mention that they could (and did!) throw the transmission into neutral while the Jeep was driving on the highway. The driver was unable to recover without turning the car off and back on again. In a followup a year later, they showed that they were able to do these attacks at any speed, including turning the steering wheel.[2] [1] https://www.wired.com/2015/07/hackers-remotely-kill-jeep-highway/ https://www.wired.com/2015/07/hackers-remotely-kill-jeep-hig... [2] https://www.wired.com/2016/08/jeep-hackers-return-high-speed-steering-acceleration-hacks/ https://www.wired.com/2016/08/jeep-hackers-return-high-speed...
tgsovlerkhgsel 7y ago
Some of the hacks demonstrated disabling brakes. All that's needed is disabling them, and then when the driver (or rather, passenger in the drivers seat of the death express) is frantically stomping on the brake, selectively re-enable them on one side.