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These "i hate debugging wandering pixels" and "i don't want to figure out why my css doesn't work" opinions sounds like they come from people who aren't really

These "i hate debugging wandering pixels" and "i don't want to figure out why my css doesn't work" opinions sounds like they come from people who aren't really front end developers; like they come from the kind of dev who would sit and complain about the frontend devs on their company, thinking that they're a lower class of people. I've been working on the server- and client-side of the web for about 10 years now, and I can't recall running into these "wandering pixel" issues they talk about in the past ~4 years. Frontend development is not just about building a cute website for grandma anymore, and that's why it's complicated. We're passing more responsibilities to the browser, and we have to care about performance when doing work there, and that's why it's complicated. Writing performant software for an unknown machine is hard, and that's why it's complicated.

sedeki 7y ago
I believe I am one of the devs that complain a lot about frontend devs, generally speaking... Don’t get me wrong — being a skilled developer (in the traditional sense) with significant competence in frontend development is extremely attractive. But this profile is actually quite uncommon imo. I have to ask, do you really think the problem with frontend development is about performance? That FE is hard because of the code is executed on unknown machines? This does not resonate with my experience.
- vcanales 7y ago
  Neither are the 'problem' with frontend development, but the reason why it has become a harder thing to do; that, IMO, is not necessarily a problem or a bad thing. FED is now about solving harder, 'more real' problems, and performance is one of those problems. Writing performant code for -potentially- old machines, mobile devices of various kinds and in the end different browsers, requires a different level of expertise. This is why I'm a bit triggered by the 'wandering pixels' and 'cant do css' comments, and I do apologize for getting a bit intense.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
alkonaut 7y ago
> they come from people who aren't really front end developers I think web frontend development transitioned from "acceptably complicated" to "way too complicated" some time around that time the first person wrote "Front End Developer" on their business card.
- vcanales 7y ago
  Software Developer who mainly works in the frontend is too long. I do agree that calling yourself either backend or frontend is not great.
  - alkonaut 7y ago
    What I meant was, initially there were frontend designers and backend developers (because there was no code on the front end at all).
- debaserab2 7y ago
  Agencies have been hiring front end developers in as actual titles since the mid 00's.
BlueTemplar 7y ago
The right tool for the job... and a web browser is NOT the right tool to build applications, especially heavy ones. (I suspect it's mostly about a power move from Google to wrestle the control over general computing from Microsoft...)

sedeki 7y ago

I believe I am one of the devs that complain a lot about frontend devs, generally speaking... Don’t get me wrong — being a skilled developer (in the traditional sense) with significant competence in frontend development is extremely attractive. But this profile is actually quite uncommon imo. I have to ask, do you really think the problem with frontend development is about performance? That FE is hard because of the code is executed on unknown machines? This does not resonate with my experience.

vcanales 7y ago
Neither are the 'problem' with frontend development, but the reason why it has become a harder thing to do; that, IMO, is not necessarily a problem or a bad thing. FED is now about solving harder, 'more real' problems, and performance is one of those problems. Writing performant code for -potentially- old machines, mobile devices of various kinds and in the end different browsers, requires a different level of expertise. This is why I'm a bit triggered by the 'wandering pixels' and 'cant do css' comments, and I do apologize for getting a bit intense.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]

alkonaut 7y ago

> they come from people who aren't really front end developers I think web frontend development transitioned from "acceptably complicated" to "way too complicated" some time around that time the first person wrote "Front End Developer" on their business card.

vcanales 7y ago
Software Developer who mainly works in the frontend is too long. I do agree that calling yourself either backend or frontend is not great.
- alkonaut 7y ago
  What I meant was, initially there were frontend designers and backend developers (because there was no code on the front end at all).
debaserab2 7y ago
Agencies have been hiring front end developers in as actual titles since the mid 00's.

BlueTemplar 7y ago

The right tool for the job... and a web browser is NOT the right tool to build applications, especially heavy ones. (I suspect it's mostly about a power move from Google to wrestle the control over general computing from Microsoft...)