3 ms·

8k billable hours per year = 153 hours per week. Not even Elon Musk works that much.

magashna 7y ago
it's easy if you eat/sleep 2.14 hours daily and work every other second of the day
howard941 7y ago
You are indeed correct. Nevertheless that's the way it is for new grads - 1st and 2nd yr fresh out of law school - at high end medium and large firms that are sort of like pyramid schemes. The associate newbies need to generate those billables (are those realtime hours? I never checked. Does the client check?). The partners get their cut from those billables. Periodically the herd is winnowed to make room for those with more energy.
- gamblor956 7y ago
  You are indeed correct. Nevertheless that's the way it is for new grads - 1st and 2nd yr fresh out of law school - at high end medium and large firms that are sort of like pyramid schemes. I'm questioning whether you have actually worked for a firm because your expectations for firm billing are wildly inaccurate as is your understanding of how billing works in a firm. 1st year lawyers bill time which generally doesn't get charged to client, because clients are unwilling to pay for training brand new lawyers. Associates after their first year generally bill between 1600 and 2400 hours/year, depending on the firm. All of those hours are actual hours worked because a lawyer who lies about that is committing fraud and can be disbarred for that (in addition to facing criminal sanctions). Clients do verify the hours billed--which is why lawyers are required to provide very detailed descriptions of hours worked, in some cases down to 6-minute intervals (i.e., tenths of an hour). Partners bill in addition to those associate hours. The only partners that get to avoid doing billable work are the rainmakers, because they do the tough work of actually acquiring paying clients. 5th-7th year associates generate the most profits for law firms because they have the highest ratio of gross billings (= hourly rate x hours billed) to salary, though partners usually generate the most revenue for their firms.
  - howard941 7y ago
    > I'm questioning whether you have actually worked for a firm because your expectations for firm billing are wildly inaccurate as is your understanding of how billing works in a firm. Let me end your speculation: All of my time was in 1 and 2 person law firms. The inflated billables are anecdata from my classmates. You may rightly call those out as anecdata. As for myself and the firms I worked in no attorney ever exceeded 1K billables in a year.
pwinnski 7y ago
If you work for 36 minutes and bill for an hour, you can bill five hours for every three hours of work. You just have to switch clients every 36 minutes.
- gamblor956 7y ago
  That is billing fraud. You are only allowed to bill a unit of time to 1 client unless the work actually involved multiple clients. Thus, if you bill a client for 1 hour, you cannot bill a separate client for that same hour. You can, however, divide up that hour and equally bill clients for a portion of the hour. If you bill on an hourly basis but switch between clients during that hour, generally you need to track your time down to portions of an hour and bill out at the end of the billing period accordingly. Thus, if you bill hourly but worked on client X for 0.56 hours 8 times, you would bill them for 4 or 5 hours at the end of the period, not 8.

it's easy if you eat/sleep 2.14 hours daily and work every other second of the day

You are indeed correct. Nevertheless that's the way it is for new grads - 1st and 2nd yr fresh out of law school - at high end medium and large firms that are sort of like pyramid schemes. The associate newbies need to generate those billables (are those realtime hours? I never checked. Does the client check?). The partners get their cut from those billables. Periodically the herd is winnowed to make room for those with more energy.

gamblor956 7y ago
You are indeed correct. Nevertheless that's the way it is for new grads - 1st and 2nd yr fresh out of law school - at high end medium and large firms that are sort of like pyramid schemes. I'm questioning whether you have actually worked for a firm because your expectations for firm billing are wildly inaccurate as is your understanding of how billing works in a firm. 1st year lawyers bill time which generally doesn't get charged to client, because clients are unwilling to pay for training brand new lawyers. Associates after their first year generally bill between 1600 and 2400 hours/year, depending on the firm. All of those hours are actual hours worked because a lawyer who lies about that is committing fraud and can be disbarred for that (in addition to facing criminal sanctions). Clients do verify the hours billed--which is why lawyers are required to provide very detailed descriptions of hours worked, in some cases down to 6-minute intervals (i.e., tenths of an hour). Partners bill in addition to those associate hours. The only partners that get to avoid doing billable work are the rainmakers, because they do the tough work of actually acquiring paying clients. 5th-7th year associates generate the most profits for law firms because they have the highest ratio of gross billings (= hourly rate x hours billed) to salary, though partners usually generate the most revenue for their firms.
- howard941 7y ago
  > I'm questioning whether you have actually worked for a firm because your expectations for firm billing are wildly inaccurate as is your understanding of how billing works in a firm. Let me end your speculation: All of my time was in 1 and 2 person law firms. The inflated billables are anecdata from my classmates. You may rightly call those out as anecdata. As for myself and the firms I worked in no attorney ever exceeded 1K billables in a year.

pwinnski 7y ago

If you work for 36 minutes and bill for an hour, you can bill five hours for every three hours of work. You just have to switch clients every 36 minutes.

gamblor956 7y ago
That is billing fraud. You are only allowed to bill a unit of time to 1 client unless the work actually involved multiple clients. Thus, if you bill a client for 1 hour, you cannot bill a separate client for that same hour. You can, however, divide up that hour and equally bill clients for a portion of the hour. If you bill on an hourly basis but switch between clients during that hour, generally you need to track your time down to portions of an hour and bill out at the end of the billing period accordingly. Thus, if you bill hourly but worked on client X for 0.56 hours 8 times, you would bill them for 4 or 5 hours at the end of the period, not 8.