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I can't remember it but there was a group of people in Oregon trying to start their own health insurance company. They figured out how to do it like a billion t

I can't remember it but there was a group of people in Oregon trying to start their own health insurance company. They figured out how to do it like a billion times cheaper than the big companies. Eventually they got blasted by a government agency that didn't allow them to operate at those rates because it would be untenable. Unfortunately I think the government doesn't realize it but they have been bending over backwards for the insurance companies to regulate that way. If you take out the rent seeking apparently healthcare and health insurance may actually be cheap. We just have a ton of laws preventing us from having that. If anyone heard about this group on NPR/OPB let me know I can't seem to find them.

javagram 7y ago
Not sure if this is what you’re thinking of, but https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health_care_sharing_ministry https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health_care_sharing_ministry is similar. They were grandfathered under Obamacare and are apparently legal in most states. Of course the thing is the reason the costs are cheaper than insurance is also because they don’t cover as much. Some insurance plans are incredibly expensive just because they have to spend multi-millions on a single person’s care.
- rhacker 7y ago
  No it definitely was not a sharing ministry. Those are not real insurance companies. This was an effort to start a real insurance company with rates that reflected a careful study of how much money is really needed to protect its population.
- WkndTriathlete 7y ago
  Insurance plans are incredibly expensive because not only are you paying for legitimate health-care expenses, you are also paying for: * hospital administrators to interact with insurers * insurers employees/administration * ICD9/ICD10 coding overhead * and add 10% for the maximum legal profit health insurers are allowed to make I have to think that removal of those four elements from health insurance costs would result in significantly lower health care cost outlay in the US. Routine care can be cheap. We really only need coverage for catastrophic care - broken bones, herniated disc, acute injuries, etc., etc., and routine care benefits for those so impoverished as to not be able to afford it. IMO, of course.
  - SolaceQuantum 7y ago
    "Routine care can be cheap. We really only need coverage for catastrophic care - broken bones, herniated disc, acute injuries, etc., etc., and routine care benefits for those so impoverished as to not be able to afford it. IMO, of course." Where do chronic illnesses, hearing aids, HIV, diabetes, dialysis, mental health intevention and outpatient therapy, etc. fall under that paradigm?
- fucking_tragedy 7y ago
  One of the reasons they're so cheap is that they have no obligation to cover claims. Claim coverage is 100% up to their discretion. They aren't really insurance.
asdfman123 7y ago
Isn't Amazon teaming up with Berkshire Hathaway and JP Morgan to do something similar? I'm sure they have enough lobbying firepower to survive external threats. I read that the announcement caused other health care stocks shed billions in value. I hope they succeed and actually provide something useful. It makes sense that other companies wouldn't want their paychecks being sapped away by health insurance.
- snarf21 7y ago
  They are but it is first and foremost to cut their own expenses for healthcare. If they can figure it out, they could eventually turn it into a business. However, part of the cost in today's healthcare is not about the misaligned incentives it is about our need for convenience. We work closely with a hospital group that does over $1B in annual revenue. They built a bunch of UrgentCare facilities to try to lower costs and run a smaller ED unit. What they found is that the UC usage is high but the ED has barely decreased at all. People complain about cost and go the UC when their kid clearly has a cold and has had it for all of 4 hours. It costs a lot of money to build and staff these UCs. That is part of what makes healthcare so expensive. We want our health to be as convenient as Netflix. We want it all on-demand and instant satisfaction. It doesn't work that way, sometimes a virus just needs to run its course and your kid just needs rest. But we pay lots of money looking for magic fix anyway.
  - asdfman123 7y ago
    As you might know, the whole "death panel" debate came about because a huge part of the cost reduction in Obamacare was supposed to come from rational end of life planning, where nurses would prompt people to describe what they actually want in case of a terminal illness in advance. Right now, we just spend fortunes trying to prolong people's suffering. However, it got political and the provision died. Politics are stupid.

javagram 7y ago

Not sure if this is what you’re thinking of, but https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health_care_sharing_ministry https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health_care_sharing_ministry is similar. They were grandfathered under Obamacare and are apparently legal in most states. Of course the thing is the reason the costs are cheaper than insurance is also because they don’t cover as much. Some insurance plans are incredibly expensive just because they have to spend multi-millions on a single person’s care.

rhacker 7y ago
No it definitely was not a sharing ministry. Those are not real insurance companies. This was an effort to start a real insurance company with rates that reflected a careful study of how much money is really needed to protect its population.
WkndTriathlete 7y ago
Insurance plans are incredibly expensive because not only are you paying for legitimate health-care expenses, you are also paying for: * hospital administrators to interact with insurers * insurers employees/administration * ICD9/ICD10 coding overhead * and add 10% for the maximum legal profit health insurers are allowed to make I have to think that removal of those four elements from health insurance costs would result in significantly lower health care cost outlay in the US. Routine care can be cheap. We really only need coverage for catastrophic care - broken bones, herniated disc, acute injuries, etc., etc., and routine care benefits for those so impoverished as to not be able to afford it. IMO, of course.
- SolaceQuantum 7y ago
  "Routine care can be cheap. We really only need coverage for catastrophic care - broken bones, herniated disc, acute injuries, etc., etc., and routine care benefits for those so impoverished as to not be able to afford it. IMO, of course." Where do chronic illnesses, hearing aids, HIV, diabetes, dialysis, mental health intevention and outpatient therapy, etc. fall under that paradigm?
fucking_tragedy 7y ago
One of the reasons they're so cheap is that they have no obligation to cover claims. Claim coverage is 100% up to their discretion. They aren't really insurance.

asdfman123 7y ago

Isn't Amazon teaming up with Berkshire Hathaway and JP Morgan to do something similar? I'm sure they have enough lobbying firepower to survive external threats. I read that the announcement caused other health care stocks shed billions in value. I hope they succeed and actually provide something useful. It makes sense that other companies wouldn't want their paychecks being sapped away by health insurance.

snarf21 7y ago
They are but it is first and foremost to cut their own expenses for healthcare. If they can figure it out, they could eventually turn it into a business. However, part of the cost in today's healthcare is not about the misaligned incentives it is about our need for convenience. We work closely with a hospital group that does over $1B in annual revenue. They built a bunch of UrgentCare facilities to try to lower costs and run a smaller ED unit. What they found is that the UC usage is high but the ED has barely decreased at all. People complain about cost and go the UC when their kid clearly has a cold and has had it for all of 4 hours. It costs a lot of money to build and staff these UCs. That is part of what makes healthcare so expensive. We want our health to be as convenient as Netflix. We want it all on-demand and instant satisfaction. It doesn't work that way, sometimes a virus just needs to run its course and your kid just needs rest. But we pay lots of money looking for magic fix anyway.
- asdfman123 7y ago
  As you might know, the whole "death panel" debate came about because a huge part of the cost reduction in Obamacare was supposed to come from rational end of life planning, where nurses would prompt people to describe what they actually want in case of a terminal illness in advance. Right now, we just spend fortunes trying to prolong people's suffering. However, it got political and the provision died. Politics are stupid.