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So what happens to our economy when 100s of thousands to people are out of a work because the government shit down the insurance company they worked for? I not

So what happens to our economy when 100s of thousands to people are out of a work because the government shit down the insurance company they worked for? I not saying things can't be better but a instant (or even a short roll out time) would kill our economy. Why doesn't anyone mention that.

derg 7y ago
They work during the transition period and get jobs working for the single payer type system which will need to be expanded. Those who don't, can find another job and(!) still have insurance.
opportune 7y ago
That’s barely a blip in the US workforce and I think they could find other administrative jobs given enough time. Nobody objects to other jobs becoming technologically obsolete (except coal mining for some reason) so not sure what the issue is
- mywittyname 7y ago
  Most of the people on the hospital side of this are medical professionals with active licenses and degrees, so finding another hospital job would not be an issue for them. I'm not sure about the insurance side, but I think it's the same situation: they employ medical professionals to review claims to dispute the care given. The non-medical personnel should also not have any issues finding new jobs. Executives, accountants, managers, and IT people have cross-industry skillsets.
qsymmachus 7y ago
Sure we could ban child labor, but then millions of children would be out of a job. I'm only half joking – the problem with this argument is that it can be used to justify almost any injustice or inefficiency if there is a cost to fixing it. You are right to flag the issue, and most serious proposals to introduce single payer healthcare in the United States also lay out a transition plan for health care workers to move from the private to public sector.
asark 7y ago
> “I don’t think in ideological terms. I never have,” Obama said, continuing on the healthcare theme. “Everybody who supports single-payer healthcare says, ‘Look at all this money we would be saving from insurance and paperwork.’ That represents 1 million, 2 million, 3 million jobs of people who are working at Blue Cross Blue Shield or Kaiser or other places. What are we doing with them? Where are we employing them?” — Then-Senator Obama, 2006 So they do talk about it, and it's one of several drag-on-the-economy stealth (useless—one of the categories of the "bullshit" classification, in Graeber's taxonomy) jobs programs we have, because we can't have better-run more-beneficial actual jobs programs since those would be socialist. [EDIT] source of the quote: https://www.thenation.com/article/mr-obama-goes-washington/ https://www.thenation.com/article/mr-obama-goes-washington/
- HillaryBriss 7y ago
  Some of them could work for the government doing the same thing they do now. There's plenty of Medicare fraud that needs to be prevented. If Medicare for all is enacted, fraudsters will be coming out of the woodwork.
grepthisab 7y ago
Isn't this like saying we shouldn't shut down coal plants because the coal plant workers would be out of a job?
pureliquidhw 7y ago
I've thought about this, and a large component of the importance of continued employment is of course money, but more important is the insurance provided. If a public option came to be, the "safety" of those left jobless would be intact while they searched for another position. Ask any employer, there is a massive talent shortage. Anyone competent should be able to find a job. Also, health insurance companies could pivot to "fast-lane" service offered through independent providers as an actual benefit, no need to just die. The insurance industry's crumbling would not happen immediately, and there would be years of legal hearings at the state and federal level. Humana/BCBS would not go down quietly due to legislation. Employees would have plenty of time to slowly leave, and these large employers should have the foresight to not replace 1:1 as they're under the legeslative gun. Obviously losing "job slots" is a big deal, and I'm sure you'll see people on both sides of the aisle cry foul as this anti-insurance sentiment gains traction, but it's not as big of a crisis as the jobs in jeopardy from global warming and automation. But we can keep an unnecessary institution afloat much easier than we can change global environmental and economic policy, so I expect insurance jobs will be safe for a good long while.
MisterBastahrd 7y ago
Because it isn't true. The money that used to be paid to them doesn't magically disappear.
sjg007 7y ago
Economies restructure all the time. A manufacturing plant goes abroad.. what do we offer the former employees? Job retraining. They can specialize in helping out medicare for all or otherwise find new jobs.
maximente 7y ago
there's an immediate recession. yep, it's true. GDP will fall, maybe for a few quarters. but, i liken it to cleaning out an infection. most job growth in health care is admin., not people who actually see patients. so there's rotten scaffolding propping up the system that's basically completely parasitic (i'm not blaming said individuals here, just stating facts). required reading: https://hbr.org/2013/09/the-downside-of-health-care-job-growth https://hbr.org/2013/09/the-downside-of-health-care-job-grow... however - and this is key - the rest of the country are better off in the long run, because they can do things like: - avoid silent taxes like figuring out which doctor/procedure is covered, arguing with insurance companies after the fact, stress/anxiety/putting off care due to above, bankruptcy as a result of whims of insurance companies - start a business bc they don't have to stay in a horrible job for private health insurance coverage - invest in themselves (education, etc.) bc they don't have to stay in a horrible job for private health insurance coverage - start to get healthier and get preventative because they can actually afford to go see a doctor without a high probability of bankruptcy (this occasionally happens even with """good insurance""") - business can now eliminate this axis as general benefit (does your health insurance accept my dentist?) so yeah, it's gotta get taken care of. either we do it now (painful) or we do it later (immensely more painful).

derg 7y ago

They work during the transition period and get jobs working for the single payer type system which will need to be expanded. Those who don't, can find another job and(!) still have insurance.

opportune 7y ago

That’s barely a blip in the US workforce and I think they could find other administrative jobs given enough time. Nobody objects to other jobs becoming technologically obsolete (except coal mining for some reason) so not sure what the issue is

mywittyname 7y ago
Most of the people on the hospital side of this are medical professionals with active licenses and degrees, so finding another hospital job would not be an issue for them. I'm not sure about the insurance side, but I think it's the same situation: they employ medical professionals to review claims to dispute the care given. The non-medical personnel should also not have any issues finding new jobs. Executives, accountants, managers, and IT people have cross-industry skillsets.

qsymmachus 7y ago

Sure we could ban child labor, but then millions of children would be out of a job. I'm only half joking – the problem with this argument is that it can be used to justify almost any injustice or inefficiency if there is a cost to fixing it. You are right to flag the issue, and most serious proposals to introduce single payer healthcare in the United States also lay out a transition plan for health care workers to move from the private to public sector.

asark 7y ago

> “I don’t think in ideological terms. I never have,” Obama said, continuing on the healthcare theme. “Everybody who supports single-payer healthcare says, ‘Look at all this money we would be saving from insurance and paperwork.’ That represents 1 million, 2 million, 3 million jobs of people who are working at Blue Cross Blue Shield or Kaiser or other places. What are we doing with them? Where are we employing them?” — Then-Senator Obama, 2006 So they do talk about it, and it's one of several drag-on-the-economy stealth (useless—one of the categories of the "bullshit" classification, in Graeber's taxonomy) jobs programs we have, because we can't have better-run more-beneficial actual jobs programs since those would be socialist. [EDIT] source of the quote: https://www.thenation.com/article/mr-obama-goes-washington/ https://www.thenation.com/article/mr-obama-goes-washington/

HillaryBriss 7y ago
Some of them could work for the government doing the same thing they do now. There's plenty of Medicare fraud that needs to be prevented. If Medicare for all is enacted, fraudsters will be coming out of the woodwork.

grepthisab 7y ago

Isn't this like saying we shouldn't shut down coal plants because the coal plant workers would be out of a job?

pureliquidhw 7y ago

I've thought about this, and a large component of the importance of continued employment is of course money, but more important is the insurance provided. If a public option came to be, the "safety" of those left jobless would be intact while they searched for another position. Ask any employer, there is a massive talent shortage. Anyone competent should be able to find a job. Also, health insurance companies could pivot to "fast-lane" service offered through independent providers as an actual benefit, no need to just die. The insurance industry's crumbling would not happen immediately, and there would be years of legal hearings at the state and federal level. Humana/BCBS would not go down quietly due to legislation. Employees would have plenty of time to slowly leave, and these large employers should have the foresight to not replace 1:1 as they're under the legeslative gun. Obviously losing "job slots" is a big deal, and I'm sure you'll see people on both sides of the aisle cry foul as this anti-insurance sentiment gains traction, but it's not as big of a crisis as the jobs in jeopardy from global warming and automation. But we can keep an unnecessary institution afloat much easier than we can change global environmental and economic policy, so I expect insurance jobs will be safe for a good long while.

MisterBastahrd 7y ago

Because it isn't true. The money that used to be paid to them doesn't magically disappear.

sjg007 7y ago

Economies restructure all the time. A manufacturing plant goes abroad.. what do we offer the former employees? Job retraining. They can specialize in helping out medicare for all or otherwise find new jobs.

maximente 7y ago

there's an immediate recession. yep, it's true. GDP will fall, maybe for a few quarters. but, i liken it to cleaning out an infection. most job growth in health care is admin., not people who actually see patients. so there's rotten scaffolding propping up the system that's basically completely parasitic (i'm not blaming said individuals here, just stating facts). required reading: https://hbr.org/2013/09/the-downside-of-health-care-job-growth https://hbr.org/2013/09/the-downside-of-health-care-job-grow... however - and this is key - the rest of the country are better off in the long run, because they can do things like: - avoid silent taxes like figuring out which doctor/procedure is covered, arguing with insurance companies after the fact, stress/anxiety/putting off care due to above, bankruptcy as a result of whims of insurance companies - start a business bc they don't have to stay in a horrible job for private health insurance coverage - invest in themselves (education, etc.) bc they don't have to stay in a horrible job for private health insurance coverage - start to get healthier and get preventative because they can actually afford to go see a doctor without a high probability of bankruptcy (this occasionally happens even with """good insurance""") - business can now eliminate this axis as general benefit (does your health insurance accept my dentist?) so yeah, it's gotta get taken care of. either we do it now (painful) or we do it later (immensely more painful).