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Why would China ever want to allow that U.S. companies to sue the living crap out of local businesses because of copyright? Is there anything that China can win

by sod 7y ago

Why would China ever want to allow that U.S. companies to sue the living crap out of local businesses because of copyright? Is there anything that China can win here? I always thought the chinese governments strategy was to grow local businesses. Global copyright enforcement would stomp that.

internet_user 7y ago
I'm still amazed how they are not under sanctions for wholesale IP theft. They must have thousands of key decision makers in the West in their pocket.
- mempko 7y ago
  Western companies have been happy to hand over IP. It's part of the deal. If they didn't like the deal, they wouldn't have gone to China. It can't be called 'theft' when it was willingly given.
  - internet_user 7y ago
    Pretty certain that wholesale theft was not part of the "voluntary deal". Can you point to exact language in agreements that granted them absolute rights to any IP? However, the western executives that signed those deals, have long made their massive bonuses, it's all been paid out and some of those execs probably even retired. What do they care? Such a great way to raid the company you manage at the expense of shareholders/employees.
    - yorwba 7y ago
      > Can you point to exact language in agreements that granted them absolute rights to any IP? Those agreements between private entities are almost certainly not public. However, I found a press release by Siemens AG [1] that says "Part of the contractual terms and conditions involves support and technology transfer in connection with production of the trains." In another press release [2], a Siemens VP is quite chipper about this: "Siemens is even more confident to support the development and modernization of Chinese railways and transfer highly advanced and proven technology of international standard to China" I don't think you can speak of "wholesale theft" in this case of a voluntary deal. [1] https://www.siemens.com/press/en/pr_cc/2005/11_nov/tstr20051106_(china)_1328506.htm https://www.siemens.com/press/en/pr_cc/2005/11_nov/tstr20051... [2] https://www.siemens.com/press/en/pr_cc/2006/04_apr/tstk20060519_1373993.htm https://www.siemens.com/press/en/pr_cc/2006/04_apr/tstk20060...
      - internet_user 7y ago
        Read something other than marketing materials for PR purposes. The CEO of Siemens at the time was Klaus Kleinfeld. The bribery scandals were so bad in 2007 that he was forced out, and forced to settle with Siemens, 2 millions euros. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klaus_Kleinfeld#Bribery_investigation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klaus_Kleinfeld#Bribery_invest... Now, ostensibly, these were scandals about Siemens bribing other countries. Do you think people at Siemens, with such high moral integrity, managed to pocket some bribes themselves? Perhaps in exchange for handing over valuable IP? What's a signature or two between friends.
        yorwba 7y ago
        I don't see a reason for discounting Siemens' own PR department as a source for what the decision-makers at Siemens think of deals they make. Whether they were bribed to agree is a different matter. In any case, it was public knowledge that technology would be transferred, so still not something I'd call "theft".
- sct202 7y ago
  Generally for IP violations, you get sued. Like Huawei has been sued a bunch.
- basch 7y ago
  >Still, the State Department warned - as it had for years - that publicly confronting China over its online economic warfare would damage relations with Beijing, so American government statements about the hacking did not disclose the scope of China's efforts. https://www.newsweek.com/2013/11/01/how-edward-snowden-escalated-cyber-war-243886.html https://www.newsweek.com/2013/11/01/how-edward-snowden-escal...

by sod 7y ago

internet_user 7y ago

I'm still amazed how they are not under sanctions for wholesale IP theft. They must have thousands of key decision makers in the West in their pocket.

mempko 7y ago
Western companies have been happy to hand over IP. It's part of the deal. If they didn't like the deal, they wouldn't have gone to China. It can't be called 'theft' when it was willingly given.
- internet_user 7y ago
  Pretty certain that wholesale theft was not part of the "voluntary deal". Can you point to exact language in agreements that granted them absolute rights to any IP? However, the western executives that signed those deals, have long made their massive bonuses, it's all been paid out and some of those execs probably even retired. What do they care? Such a great way to raid the company you manage at the expense of shareholders/employees.
  - yorwba 7y ago
    > Can you point to exact language in agreements that granted them absolute rights to any IP? Those agreements between private entities are almost certainly not public. However, I found a press release by Siemens AG [1] that says "Part of the contractual terms and conditions involves support and technology transfer in connection with production of the trains." In another press release [2], a Siemens VP is quite chipper about this: "Siemens is even more confident to support the development and modernization of Chinese railways and transfer highly advanced and proven technology of international standard to China" I don't think you can speak of "wholesale theft" in this case of a voluntary deal. [1] https://www.siemens.com/press/en/pr_cc/2005/11_nov/tstr20051106_(china)_1328506.htm https://www.siemens.com/press/en/pr_cc/2005/11_nov/tstr20051... [2] https://www.siemens.com/press/en/pr_cc/2006/04_apr/tstk20060519_1373993.htm https://www.siemens.com/press/en/pr_cc/2006/04_apr/tstk20060...
    - internet_user 7y ago
      Read something other than marketing materials for PR purposes. The CEO of Siemens at the time was Klaus Kleinfeld. The bribery scandals were so bad in 2007 that he was forced out, and forced to settle with Siemens, 2 millions euros. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klaus_Kleinfeld#Bribery_investigation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klaus_Kleinfeld#Bribery_invest... Now, ostensibly, these were scandals about Siemens bribing other countries. Do you think people at Siemens, with such high moral integrity, managed to pocket some bribes themselves? Perhaps in exchange for handing over valuable IP? What's a signature or two between friends.
      - yorwba 7y ago
        I don't see a reason for discounting Siemens' own PR department as a source for what the decision-makers at Siemens think of deals they make. Whether they were bribed to agree is a different matter. In any case, it was public knowledge that technology would be transferred, so still not something I'd call "theft".
sct202 7y ago
Generally for IP violations, you get sued. Like Huawei has been sued a bunch.
basch 7y ago
>Still, the State Department warned - as it had for years - that publicly confronting China over its online economic warfare would damage relations with Beijing, so American government statements about the hacking did not disclose the scope of China's efforts. https://www.newsweek.com/2013/11/01/how-edward-snowden-escalated-cyber-war-243886.html https://www.newsweek.com/2013/11/01/how-edward-snowden-escal...